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3 Big Reasons Why The ‘Greek Debt Deal’ Is Really A German Trap

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Trap - Public DomainGreece is saved? All over the planet, news headlines are boldly proclaiming that a “deal” has been reached which will give Greece the money that it needs and keep it in the eurozone.  But as you will see below, this is not true at all.  Yesterday, when I wrote that “there never was going to be any deal“, I was not exaggerating.  This “deal” was not drafted with the intention of “saving Greece”.  As I explained in my previous article, these negotiations were all about setting up Greece for eviction from the euro.  You see, the truth is that Greece desperately wants to stay in the euro, but Germany (and allies such as Finland) want Greece out.  Since Germany can’t simply order Greece to leave the euro, they need some sort of legal framework which will make it possible, and that is what this new “deal” provides.  As I am about to explain, there are all kinds of conditions that must be satisfied and hurdles that must be crossed before Greece ever sees a single penny.  If there is a single hiccup along the way, and this is what the Germans are counting on, Greece will be ejected from the eurozone.  This “deal” has been designed to fail so that the Germans can get what they have wanted all along.  I think that three very famous words from Admiral Ackbar sum up the situation very well: “It’s a trap!

So why is this “Greek debt deal” really a German trap?

The following are three big reasons…

#1 The “Deal” Is Designed To Be Rejected By The Greek Parliament

If Germany really wanted to save Greece, they would have already done so.  Instead, now they have forced Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras to agree to much, much harsher austerity terms than Greek voters overwhelmingly rejected during the recent referendum by a vote of 61 percent to 39 percent.  Tsipras has only been given until Wednesday to pass a whole bunch of new laws, and another week to make another series of major economic changes.  The following comes from CNN

Greece has to swiftly pass a series of new laws. Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras has until Wednesday to convince Parliament to pass the first few, including pension cuts and higher taxes.

Assuming that happens, Greek lawmakers have another week, until July 22, to enact another batch of economic changes. These include adopting European Union rules on how to manage banks in crisis, and do a major overhaul to make Greece’s civil courts faster and more efficient.

Can Tsipras actually get all this done in such a short amount of time?

The Germans are hoping that he can’t.  And already, two of Syriza’s coalition partners have publicly declared that they have no intention of voting in favor of this “deal”.  The following is from a Bloomberg report

Discontent brewed as Tsipras arrived back in the Greek capital. Left Platform, a faction within Syriza, and his coalition partners, the Independent Greeks party, both signaled they won’t be able to support the deal. That opposition alone would wipe out Tsipras’s 12-seat majority in parliament, forcing him to rely on opposition votes to carry the day.

The terms of the “deal” are not extremely draconian because the Germans want to destroy Greek sovereignty as many are suggesting.  Rather, they are designed to provoke an overwhelmingly negative reaction in Greece so that the Greeks will willingly choose to reject the deal and thus be booted out of the euro.

And this is what we are seeing.  So far, the response of the Greek public toward this deal has been overwhelmingly negative

Haralambos Rouliskos, a 60-year-old economist who was out walking in Athens, described the deal as “misery, humiliation and slavery”.

Katerina Katsaba, a 52-year-old working for a pharmaceutical company, said: “I am not in favour of this deal. I know they (the eurozone creditors) are trying to blackmail us.”

On Wednesday, the union for Greek public workers has even called a 24 hour strike to protest this “agreement”

Greece’s public workers are being called to stage a 24-hour strike on Wednesday, the day their country’s parliament is to vote on reforms needed to unlock the bankster eurozone plan agreed to by Greek Prime Minster Alex Tsipras.

Their union, Adedy, called for the stoppage in a statement issued today, saying it was against the agreement reached with the eurozone.

The Greek government is not guaranteed any money right now.

According to Bloomberg, the Greek government must pass all of the laws being imposed upon them by the EU “before Greece can even begin negotiations with creditors to access a third international bailout in five years.”

The Germans and their allies are actually hoping that there is a huge backlash in Greece and that Tsipras fails to get this package pushed through the Greek parliament.  If that happens, Greece gets ejected from the euro, and Germany doesn’t look like the bad guy.

#2 Even If The “Deal” Miraculously Gets Through The Greek Parliament, It May Not Survive Other European Parliaments

The Greek parliament is not the only legislative body that must approve this new deal.  The German and Finnish parliaments (among others) must also approve it.  According to USA Today, it is being projected that the German and Finnish parliaments will probably vote on this new deal on Thursday or Friday…

Thursday/Friday, July 16/17: Eurozone parliaments must also agree to the plan for Greece’s $95 billion bailout. The biggest tests may come from Finland and Germany, two nations especially critical of Greece’s handling of the crisis. Berlin has contributed the most to Greece’s loans.

Either Germany or Finland could kill the entire “deal” with a single “no” vote.

Finnish Finance Minister Alexander Stubb has already stated that Finland “cannot agree” with a new bailout for Greece, and it is highly questionable whether or not the German parliament will give it approval.

I think that the Germans and their allies would much prefer for the Greeks to reject the deal and walk away, but it may come down to one of these parliaments drawing a line in the sand.

#3 The Deal Makes Implementation Extraordinarily Difficult

If Greece fails to live up to each and every one of the extremely draconian measures demanded in the “deal”, they will be booted from the eurozone.

And if you take a look at what is being demanded of them, it is extremely unrealistic.  Here is just one example…

For instance, the Greek government agreed to transfer up to 50 billion euros worth of Greek assets to an independent fund that will raise money from privatization.

According to the document, 25 billion euros from this fund will be poured into the banks, 12.5 billion will be used to pay off debt, and the remaining 12.5 billion to boost the economy through investment.

The fund will be based in Greece and run by the Greeks, but with supervision from European authorities.

Where in the world is the Greek government going to find 50 billion euros worth of assets at this point?  The Greek government is flat broke and the banks are insolvent.

But if they don’t find 50 billion euros worth of assets, they have violated the agreement and they get booted.

This whole thing is about setting up Greece for failure so that there is a legal excuse to boot them out of the euro.

And it actually almost happened very early on Monday morning.  The following comes from Business Insider

As the FT tells it, German Chancellor Angela Merkel and Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras rose from their chairs at 6 a.m. on Monday and headed for the door, resigned to a Greek exit from the euro.

“Sorry, but there is no way you are leaving this room,” European Council president Donald Tusk reportedly said.

And so a Grexit was avoided.

For the moment, Greece has supposedly been “saved”.

But anyone that believes that this crisis is “over” is just being delusional.

The Germans and their allies have successfully lured the Greek government into a trap. Thanks to Tsipras, they have been handed a legal framework for getting rid of Greece.

All they have to do now is wait for just the right moment to spring the trap, and it might just happen a lot sooner than a lot of people may think.

  • jakartaman

    As I said in the last blog.
    This is the dying gasp of a dead country.
    It all for PC feel Good
    Greece will be out of the Euro by years end or sooner!

    • MichaelfromTheEconomicCollapse

      Very well said jakartaman.

      • Gay Veteran

        not really, the US empire does not want Greece out of the Euro because then there is the possibility that Greece leaves NATO (and the neo-cons need NATO for more wars)

      • Gay Veteran

        Paul Craig Roberts:

        “…Washington has a higher interest than the interests of the US financial interests who purchased discounted sovereign [Greek] debt with a view toward profiting from a deal that pays 100 cents on the dollar. Washington also has higher interest than the interests of the European One Percent intent on using Greece’s indebtedness to loot the country of its national assets. Washington’s higher interest is the protection of the unity of the EU and, thereby, NATO, Washington’s mechanism for bringing conflict to Russia.

        If the inflexible Germans were to have Greece booted from the EU, Greece’s turn to Russia and financial rescue would put the same idea in the heads of Italy and Spain and perhaps ultimately France. NATO would unravel as Southern Europe became members of Russia’s Eurasian trade bloc, and American power would unravel with NATO….”

        This is simply unacceptable to Washington.

    • XSANDIEGOCA

      How can they possibly stay? They have to go back to the Drachma.

  • Alwaystonorrow

    The Economic Collapse Blog Has Issued A RED ALERT For The Last Six Months Of 2015

    Published 6/25/2015
    172 days until 12/31/2015.

    For fun, lets do a count down every day until the end of 2015 and see just what happens.

    • Guest

      Do you expect anyone to pay attention to you when you can’t even spell the word tomorrow correctly?

      If you don’t like what the editor of this site writes, leave!

      • Alwaystomorrow

        Do you expect anyone to pay attention to you when you can’t even spell the word tomorrow correctly?………………..Yes. you did, and thanks.

        • Hillbilly

          If tomorrow never comes I can still go to the range and shoot my ammo, eat the food in my pantry, enjoy the money I saved from eating home grown vegetables, and farm fresh eggs. If tomorrow does come just what do you think you will get to enjoy?

          A life you haven’t learned yet but I honestly you do before it is to late.

          Always error on the side of caution.

          Good luck to you my friend

    • AvidReader

      There are many more people who have raised a red alert for 2015 and later. With good reasons.

    • wisdomseeker

      Don’t feed this troll anymore, just ignore the comment as it is going to be on pretty much every article this year on this site.

    • justacomment

      Go to the archives on this same page and select June of 2012 and read the first article.

      • Alwaystomorrow

        You mean this article?

        17 Reasons To Be EXTREMELY Concerned About The Second Half Of 2012…………….

        The ingredients for a “perfect storm” are slowly coming together, and in the months ahead we could very well see the next wave of the economic
        collapse strike.

    • Paul

      It is like you are just itching for to post this the instant Michael publishes his daily blog. Getting really really old.

    • MichaelfromTheEconomicCollapse

      So what do I win if I am right?

      • Hillbilly

        Bragging rights lol. I happen to think giving it until December was generous.

      • K

        You will never know. The troll will assume a new identity, and bug you about something else. Though chances are if you are right, which I think you are. They will probably crash the net, first thing anyway.

        • garys_long_lost_son

          because he writes what he believes makes him a troll?

          • Alwaystomorrow

            Unfortunately it seems that way. It reminds me of a cult where everyone believes what the leader believes and anyone who dares to question is labeled with a negative name.

      • Alwaystomorrow

        First let me say I agree with almost
        everything you say. I think the world (U.S. included) is a complete
        financial disaster and will eventually end badly.

        The
        thing that I convinced of though is that “the powers that be” will
        change and manipulate things and rules far beyond what you or I could
        possibly imagine to keep things going.

        Yes I believe it will all come to a terrible end, but to put a time frame on it is in my opinion impossible.

        The
        countdown is not intended to be disrespectful but is there to hopefully
        make the point of not putting a time frame on an economic collapse.

        So
        to answer your question “What do I get if I am right?” I could give you
        my respect, but you already have that. You tell me what you want.

    • the biggest no life is….

      Loser is back git a life!

  • Pete

    A little clarity here.

    1. “As I explained in my previous article, these negotiations were all about setting up Greece for eviction from the euro. ”

    Good. Greece should never have been in the euro in the first place …or in the EU for that matter.

    Look, when you’re driving to a destination and realize you took a wrong turn, the sooner you turn around and correct that mistake, the better off you are.

    2. “You see, the truth is that Greece desperately wants to stay in the euro, but Germany (and allies such as Finland) want Greece out.”

    Sure Greece is desperate to stay in the EU. Did you ever hear of a parasite, be in a biological realm or a social one, that wanted to separated from its host?

    3. Agreed. The Greek crisis is far from over. It will be back from with a week or three years. It’s only a matter of time

  • MIchael in Chicago

    Nice job of summing up the latest drama. I knew enough that when the mainstream media started to spout that a deal had been reached it was not over.

  • http://www.RestlessBoomers.com/ Restless Boomers

    July 12, 2015 was a repeat of September 1, 1939 and the consequences will prove equally devastating.

  • FortuneSeek3rz

    If you live in the U.S. you are in the driver’s seat. With a very healthy international demand for U.S. dollars and U.S. debt, there is little wonder why immigrants from all over the world are tripping over themselves to live in the cradle of opportunity.

    • Orac4Prez

      The demand for $US is dying extremely fast.
      1. Most countries have begun or completed deals in which transactions are no longer denominated in $US.
      2. The number of overseas students going to the US to study (and wanting to stay to get jobs) is dropping fast, they are choosing anywhere else. Koreans see their home as having the gold plated opportunities, with the US the home of white trash. (And my home of Australia is seen as “not much different”. The unskilled/uneducated ones who can’t get anything in their home country migrate)
      3. Many investment funds have options with NO US gov securities. (I have invested and when I said I wanted no US exposure. I was surprised that many investors here are demanding the same thing)
      4. There is no demand for US goods. Why is your economy in taters? Why are you running deficits?
      5. Constant pictures of riots and “unexpected social calamities and murders” and you think that is a “cradle of opportunity”

      • FortuneSeek3rz

        The 10 year yield is at 2.44% as I type this. The dollar index has skyrocketed over the last year. That’s why gold and silver are unable to move higher. There is a major black market for the greenback in Egypt, Venezuela, Mexico, Ukraine, etc…

        • Mike Smithy

          What does the 10 year yield and the dollar index have to do with manipulated gold prices?

  • Paul

    If this “deal” somehow gets through there will be widespread rioting in Greece. Americans will get a sneak peek of what is coming our way.

    • MichaelfromTheEconomicCollapse

      Yes, it amazes me that Tsipras has so readily embraced what 61 percent of his fellow citizens so overwhelmingly rejected just a short while ago.

      • Mike Smithy

        Perhaps the UE Banksters set him up with a secret bank account in Switzerland in exchange for selling out the will of the Greek people.

      • jaxon64

        Also Michael, is that his entire platform during his campaign and election was ” No Austerity”…now with his half-hearted efforts at playing hard ball, he has now gotten a deal which is multiples worse than any prior austerity demands ( essentially he is being austered ( my new word) so hard that Greece cannot possibly meet these demands and have a legitimate nation. Greece will have third world status and living conditions for generations–and the EU doesn’t want anything like that as a participatory/voting member of their little club.

      • Avner

        I’m not shocked. Tsipras kinda strikes me as the type who will tell you what he thinks you want to hear then do whatever he had in mind. It was really clear that the Greek people said no to this, and it was even more clear the contempt the EU had for the fact that a vote was even allowed.

        You know the bail-ins are still on the table, and all kind of harsh measures are in the bullpen. I saw your article about Spain.. it is nothing but a way to steal money from people.. you know who told the Spanish legislature to do that.

        You think the bankers are bold now? We haven’t seen anything yet if the Greek citizens cave to this.

  • Patrick Williams

    Either way, Greece is going to face austerity, unless I am missing something.

    If they agree to the EU deal, and it gets passed by all, then they will have more austerity then they would of originally had. If, however, the greeks reject it – or others do – they will face severe austerity also (even worse than the EU wanted out of them!).

    Greece is between a rock and a hard place with no good options – I hope America takes notice of this and learns!

    • MichaelfromTheEconomicCollapse

      Very true Patrick. Things are going to turn out badly for Greece no matter which way they turn.

    • FortuneSeek3rz

      America has national assets worth 120 trillion dollars. To compare America to Greece is ignorant at best.

      • http://www.coroflot.com/joelpeeters/portfolio Joel Peeters

        Time for you to get to your head out of where the sun does not shine.

        National Asset – $120 Trillions (ok with that)
        but,
        UNFUNDED Liabilities – $97 Trillions
        US TOTAL debt – $61 Trillions

        You tell me how you get out of that knowing that behind all of this you have the Derivative Market which is at least twice the amount of the US National Asset…

        In fact, Greece is probably in an even better situation than the US.

      • Patrick Williams

        Here is a simple way to look at this:

        The CBO estimates that our national debt will be $20 Trillion by 2020.

        Currently, the CBO says that we spend, roughly, $260 – $280 Billion annually just to serve the interest on the debt alone (forget the principle).

        In 2020, and assuming a 5% interest rate (the CBO is assuming this), our INTEREST alone on the debt will eat-up $800+ Billion annually.

        If the annual revenue the USA brings in is, roughly, $2.4 Trillion dollars, almost half of that will be needed JUST TO SERVICE THE INTEREST ON THE DEBT.

        If interests rates should be more than 5%, then we could easily be paying $1 Trillion dollars JUST TO SERVICE OUR INTEREST annually!!

        Now, on top of this, the Baby Boomers are retiring at a rate of 10,000 people each day between now and 2030. These people will start collecting Social Security and Medicare.

        Right now, there are 7 workers supporting every 1 person on Social Security but, later, it will drop to a ratio of 3 to 1 (or something like that, you can google this for exact figures – I am going by memory).

        Thus, at our current trajectory, our expenditures will far outweigh our revenue – and with a smaller work force, even less revenue will come it!

        I may be wrong, but America, unless she takes steps now to alter it, is heading for a collision course that will come to a head around 2030, IMO. If we do not takes steps NOW to correct this, we are heading for a future of implemented austerity for most Americans, IMO.

        • FortuneSeek3rz

          Patrick,

          There are many reasons to be optimistic.

          First, I predict energy prices will continue to fall by 2020. I am hopeful American’s will see their disposable income rise by an average of 5-8% between the savings of electrical costs, gasoline and natural gas.

          Second I find it unlikely, despite the CBO’s estimates, that interest rates on the 10 year bond will eclipse 5% in the next five years. I doubt the Federal Reserve believes it will either. Low interest rates are a global phenomenon that benefits the global economy. There are too many interested parties that want to see rates stay low.

          Third, the Federal Reserve purchased 4 trillion dollars in government bonds and distressed bank loans after 2008. The world was complicit in supporting American debt cancellation during that time as bond yields hit all times lows. This will likely continue far into the future should the need for QE of this level ever return.

          Fourth, America is extremely resilient in terms of innovation which is an excellent driver of future revenue. Just think of the market cap of Apple, Facebook, Wal Mart, Berkshire Hathaway, etc. America isn’t just leading the globe in business acumen, it is dominating. This will keep the dollar in demand for decades.

          Fifth, the U.S. is in complete control of monetary policy unlike Greece. It does not answer to a third party (the Troika).

          Sixth, just ten years ago the extent of many of the shale gas plays in America were largely under reported. Today America has gone from a net importer to a net exporter of natural gas. In 2000 only 1% of natural gas came from shale in the U.S. but by 2035 that will increase to 46%. The growth economy is a derivative of cheap energy.

          Also consider that doomsday predictions (I’m not saying that’s what you actually meant, but it is a common theme from viewers of this blog) have generally been wrong in American history.

          Consider:

          1 – America will never win the war with the British.
          2- America will never agree on a Constitution and form a cohesive government.
          3 – The Civil War will tear America into pieces.
          4 – America will never survive reconstruction without secession.
          5 – World War I will bankrupt America.
          6 – The Great Depression will bankrupt America and the world.
          7 – World War II will bankrupt America.
          8 – The Great Recession is the end of the dollar.
          9 – America’s debt is too large to service.

          America and the Dollar will not collapse because it will leave a hole in the global economy that is measured in the trillions. And world leaders would rather capitulate (see the recent Iran deal) than to see that happen. Everyone wants a piece of America’s pie, and the appetite is showing no signs of abating in any meaningful form.

          • Patrick Williams

            Thank you, that was a helpful post with some positive outlooks – I appreciate you sharing that – thank you so much!

          • Screamin_Ruffed_Grouse

            10- America will never dig itself into a hole from which it can’t escape.

            Smartassedness aside, I’m not an expert in these matters and am genuinely looking for insight. You say you’re hopeful that Americans’ disposable income will rise over the next few years as a result of falling energy prices. Do you see any evidence of that happening? I can only speak to my own experience and that of those around me, but what I’ve seen are steadily increasing prices for electricity, water service, and gas. Not to mention food prices have consistently gone up, and in many households that’s a bigger hit than all of the others. Gasoline fluctuates, occasionally taking a noticeable dip, but it never seems to stay that way for long.

            You mention the shale boom and American innovation, but these seem like shakey planks which to base hopes, as both are very much at the whim of the political climate of the moment. Governmental interference could cripple the shale industry in an instant, and an awful lot of people want it to do exactly that.

            Other areas of industry and innovation are equally susceptible. For instance: we all just saw the Office of Patents and Trademarks simply cancel the trademarks of the name and logos of the Washington Redskins, not for any legal reason, but merely because friends of the current crop of grand high muckety-mucks didn’t like it. The actual law was simply ignored. A contract with the government was canceled because the government didn’t like the other party. How can that not have ripple effects? Supposing other connected interests convince their pals on the hill that the trademarks- or worse, patents- of your company should simply be done away with? Where does it stop? One of the key drivers of the Great Depression was fear across the business sector of the Roosevelt administration’s make-it-up-as-you-go-along rule book. We don’t seem so far removed from that sort of thing right now.

            I do appreciate your optimism though, and hope you can answer these points with a convincing dose of some more.

          • FortuneSeek3rz

            Screamin – do you remember a website called the Oil Drum? It was dedicated to peak oil theories. Particularly those that said peak oil had already happened and we were entering a new phase of economics that would be driven by the scarcity of crude. Well, that website shut down citing “lack of new material” a few years ago.

            Keep watching the bond yields and the dollar index, ticker symbol $DXY. That will tell you more about how the world views America’s economy than the total debt outstanding.

            Remember when the Fed went on three massive rounds of QE, the international market for U.S. bond remained quite robust. That is a terrific display of confidence from some people who are experts at gauging risk.

    • Avner

      I’m sure the Greek leadership was given the choice of “plombo o plata.” They took the plata and said “screw you greek people starve LOL.”

  • horse777res

    Whats ironic is that the U.S is worse off than Greece. Our day is coming soon!!!

    • MichaelfromTheEconomicCollapse

      Indeed – and I would add that it could be a lot sooner than many people think :)

    • Bob332

      We are projected to be at 103% Debt to GDP…we also are in a sinking ship. Thanks Obozo et al.

    • Avner

      And those who get caught with their pants down have it coming. It’s plain as day if you’re informed yet you have those who want to run their mouths about “well we can just print money” or “Michael did a blog lets count the days” etc.

    • RageHard84

      I don’t know about the GDP to debt ratio, but the US can at least print its own money…

      • Raymond Chow

        Yes of course, until the world tires of it and no longer accepts the USD then we’re just as f…d

    • Gerry Keefe

      Yeah, right. You have no idea what you are talking about.

    • SunnyFlaSnotress

      Mike was wrong,wrong,wrong again. Mike’s got the Greek deal all wrong. They are working on staying in the Eurozone.
      “Since Germany can’t simply order Greece to leave the euro, they need some sort of legal framework which will make it possible, and that is what this new “deal” provides.” No.

      • Evil_shadow

        even if it wasnt rejeced (but should be), there are no guarantees that greeks will be able to hold up to their part of agreement.And germany(and finland to some extend) wont wait them forever…

  • Fee-fi-fo-fum

    Why won’t they take Putins money??

    • MichaelfromTheEconomicCollapse

      Because they want to stay in the EU.

      • Mike Smithy

        Why do they want to stay in the EU? Seriously, what is the attraction?

        • http://www.coroflot.com/joelpeeters/portfolio Joel Peeters

          Because, besides its weaknesses, its feet part clay-part iron, the EU still is an extremely powerful economic market needed by a lot of country, even China needs it.

          Notwithstanding the fact that behind the economy, the EU was meant – at least in its foundation – to avoid a new world war on the Old Continent.

          All in all, difficult for Tsipras – and the Greek Governement – to completely reject the EU. Anyway, there are a lot of things happening behind the scene we don’t even know about…

  • John G

    Michael,

    They get what they deserve. Live beyond your means and go bankrupt. Consume more than one produces and get into real trouble. This is what you have been preaching for years. Any fool knows this, it is not only the law of thermodynamics, but is common sense. Only an intellectual idiot could twist reality into spending beyond ones means is good. Only a fool could believe the utter garbage being uttered by our elite “best and brightest.” They are criminals, but worse the citizens are feeble minded.

    Liberal-socialism leads to moral and then the subsequent economic failure, for as the eye is altered, it alters all. We live in a nut house, no, a freak show of tattooed losers, gay marriage, transvestites, communist popes, Iphones, twitter, knock out games and Ferguson, Al Shartpon, and the Clintons and Bushes the only options as presidents, and that alone should have anyone terrified. If this was a boat, I would try to swim to shore.

    • jaxon64

      Yes–insanity–and this particular strain has an extremely high contagion level on a global scale.

    • Bob332

      As my economics’ professor said in the late 60’s ( he lived thru the Hitler Regime) and I will NEVER forget…. ” When a country imports MORE than it exports, the country WILL eventually fail”. We have been on that track since the 80’s and the train is coming into the station!

      • none

        Not in this case.
        As I wrote earlier, all Greece has to do is ask the Chinese for assistance. Give them a cess to there ports. And receive lots of money!
        The Russians have already said they will help.
        The U.S. can then increase it’s aid to Cuba.
        Finally, Germany can get all of there money returned!

        • df NJ

          Germany still owes Greece money from WWII war reparations.

      • Mondobeyondo

        Indeed. And unless that changes (which is highly unlikely), the U.S. isn’t coming back. Not to the economic greatness it had 50-60 years ago.

    • df NJ

      I’m still waiting to get trickled on by Reaganomics but so far it’s only been a number 2. Socialism is NOT the problem. The problems of our country are not rocket science. The lobbyists force the politicians to pass legislation creating cartels and monopolies in exchange for campaign financing. The net result is we have no free markets and bloated corporate bureaucracies smothering the worker slaves.

      “Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power.” Benito Mussolini

    • Gay Veteran

      and the reverse is true, lend money you KNOW cannot be repaid then you should lose every Euro.
      and let me give you a clue, here in AmeriKa we have fascism (the merger of state and korporate powers)

  • Patriot Alice

    They’ve set themselves up for failure. They have no one to blame but themselves. You keep trying to make the Greek’s case which is falling on deaf ears.

  • Rufus T Firefly

    Greek public workers go on strike Wednesday; no one can tell the difference.

    • jaxon64

      Greek public workers are in the classic “damned if you do- damned if you don’t” situation.
      They strike in protest of their pensions being taken away/cut and sent off to the ECB–they are screwed….
      BUT>.>.
      If no deal is struck and the banks and govt remain insolvent then there is no money to pay the pensions anyhow…again they are screwed.

  • Mike Smithy

    Why is Tsipras playing along with the charade? Can anyone explain to me what’s in it for him to play along with the BS? It would have been much more presidential for him to have walked away from the negotiation table with the EU after the referendum vote.

    • Goldfinger

      Victoria Nuland threatened him with “consequences.”

      • Mike Smithy

        What consequences? Are you suggesting that Nuland told him do as I say or you’ll be sleeping with the fishes?

        • Goldfinger

          This is how the Chicago Mob manages the foreign policy of the Empire of Chaos. She made him an offer he “could not refuse.”

          • Not Sure

            Yeah. Normally, you see Tsipras smiling at these meetings, but he hasn’t been too happy these past few days.

  • K

    I can not for the life of me, understand the attraction of the E.U. Tsipras was given a vote by the Greek people, which would have allowed him to exit. In the long run an exit would be better, than the slavery he is signing them up for. Guess the Greek politicians are as bad as the U.S. politicians. Bought and paid for.

  • GSOB

    Bottom line, the banks are still closed in Greece and 50 cent files for bankruptcy.

    • GSOB

      yeah….Benie Sanders concerns me…
      He wants $15. minimum wage across the board… to start with…
      I mean… how else is everyone going to afford the unaffordable care act?

      • GSOB

        O come on GSOB… you know you would rather see Hillary then Bernie win,… just don’t show it.

  • GetReal4U2

    time is very short…don’t be fooled by the “agreement”…an economic collapse is quickly coming…

  • piccadillybabe

    When and if the trap bites Greece in the behind, it will be a day we will all remember of where we were and what we were doing, kind of like a 911 collapse which will no doubt be displayed by the DOW and Nasdaq falling precipitiously. It’s funny how a tiny nation like Greece has impacted so much chaos world wide. It’s become a rogue wild card.

  • JailBanksters

    I knew this would happen, it had to.
    So you can’t pay your Credit Card eh ?, No
    Okay then, we will have to Issue you with another Credit Card. Do you accept the terms and conditions of this Credit Card?, No
    Okay then, your new Credit Card will arrive on Tuesday, thankyou for using Globo Bank.

  • stages

    Birth pang over…. go back to sleep

  • http://www.facebook.com/jack.harper.520562 Jack Harper

    If i recall it was Goldman Sachs who got Greece into trouble.

    • df NJ

      Google “Looting the Pension Funds”. The ruthless pirate banksters on Wall Street will steal anything and everything. And they will get it!

      Google “George Carlin The Best 3 Minutes of His Career”. George Carlin had it exactly right years ago. George Carlin is a modern day prophet!

      • Robert C.

        Carlin was the truth.

  • Phil from Germany

    What I dont understand are the trillions in Derivatives held by Deutsch bank, default there as well ?. That could easily make life a little unpleasent here in Germany. General feeling here , had enough of paying more tax all the time

    • Not Sure

      Yeah, you guys are taxed to death and unemployment is high.

  • tom

    vote trump!

    • df NJ

      The best thing about Trump is the way he roasts the reporters interviewing him. He’s a real barracuda with the smart donkey reporters.

  • XSANDIEGOCA

    America has been sold out in a similar way. I flatly predict the day will come when we shall sit starving by the rail bed as we watch the rail cars filled with our wheat roll past on their way to China. Pay close attention to what is going on here. Our day is coming. Look, the government has doubled our debt in 7 years. Unfunded liabilities North of 100 trillions. Worse, we have offshored the means of production. We can’t even produce our way out. We get by on borrowing, QE and increasingly crushing taxes. There will be the proverbial straw.

    • Avner

      You know, the Greek people said no, and their “leader” took a dive and caved in anyway. What the Greek people do next will be telling. If they cave as well, the bankers will get VERY bold and start running even more roughshod than before.

      • XSANDIEGOCA

        I half expect German Paratroopers to invade.

        • Avner

          Personally I expect a lot of the Greeks to go along to get along as long as they get a handout. Even more for our people here in the USA. The question is, will the handout get them anything? You know bail ins are still likely.

          I see the pics of the Greek pensioners crying in the streets.. I have zero empathy for them. In this day and age where unlimited info is at your fingertips, ignorance is a choice not a condition.

          • Stan

            Sheep….. perhaps American’s will be the same way if the collapse occurs as slowly as the Greek collapse has…. We all will be desperately clinging onto what we have had in fear of losing the last bit of our wealth. A lot of folks will go down in the ship along the way.

            If the Greeks meakly go along with this without a total riot, we know the sheep have spoken….

          • Screamin_Ruffed_Grouse

            Just curious (honestly), what do you think Greeks rioting will accomplish other than to further impoverish themselves? Successfully waging war against a country that is harming them perhaps, but as I understand it that’s highly unlikely.

          • Stan

            Why do you assume because I make this statement, that I want it to happen…?

            If you look at how our US Constitution was written, you can clearly see that the framers put in our ability to remove and replace our out of control government. It is clear to see our federfederal government has grown in size and scope far beyond what the framers envisioned. We have allowed it and we continue to allow it with each encroaching Executive Order and each draconian edict the unelected bureaucratic “Department-of’s” creates.

            My assertion is this, if we continue to slowly creep down this path, the boiling frog in the pot of water (the United States) will continue to take it willfully. If something happens to drastically, and quickly increase the rate of obscurity, we will see an uprising.

            My money is on the frog boiling to death.

            Greece’s demise seems to be on the same path.

        • Mondobeyondo

          They actually did invade Greece in 1941.. the circumstances are a bit different today though.

    • df NJ

      Just raise taxes and close some of our 800+ foreign military bases. We do not have unsolvable problems. Just a bunch of donkeys in the way from doing anything politically meaningful. Why even have Congress? They never do anything meaningful. We might as well have a right wing military style dictatorship and be done with it. Everyone loves the military. Everyone hates Congress. Heck, let’s just outsource our government and let Israel run our government. Oh wait, that already happened.

      • XSANDIEGOCA

        Careful what you wish for…

      • tacoma

        In the latest Pentagon strategic white paper it identifies both Russia and China pose ‘existential’ threats to the United States. Thus requiring a military build up bigger than the Cold War. Perhaps the Pentagon want to build its own island right next to China’s little island in the disputed S China sea, and park an aircraft carrier there. Of course this is in response to China ‘aggression’ to take over the Pacific.

        • Gay Veteran

          Russia and China refuse to be American vassals, thus they are a threat

      • joe oberr

        That would be an excellent start. Warfare and welfare deficit spending have to end or we will end up like Greece.

  • danbax

    dow might fall today. its at the top of a 3 month chart trendline. on longer term charts its formed a rounded top reversal pattern

  • puerto rico reporter

    The only way for a country such as Greece to end its misery,is to simply go back to its old currency but back it with a real asset or whatever they still have left,that hasnt been stolen by its greedy vultures,the ECB.
    Lets face it,this “Funny Money Fiat Backed up the good faith of its government” experiment has FAILED,it was never intended to serve a real purpose but rather intended to be a global trap for the masses and right now,as we speak,the final goal is nearly complete.

  • df NJ

    Geben Sie uns Ihren Ruhestand Geld, ja!

  • df NJ

    Google “George Carlin The Best 3 Minutes of His Career”. George Carlin had it exactly right years ago. George Carlin is a modern day prophet!

  • Not Sure

    This is a comment that was posted on another financial page that really gives some good background/history as to what is going on:

    The 2010/2012 rescue package was €240 billion of which something like €206 billion has been paid out. The key element here is that 77% of the funds went to German/French banks in order to save them from collapse.

    Simply put, the eurozone used the Greek taxpayers to save itself and the banks.

    The ECB entered the scene also in 2010 and by summer 2011 the Target2 imbalance (for Greece) was a little over €100 billion. We then got the “whatever it takes” pronouncement by ECB president Mario Draghi in July 2012 and deposits started to flow back into Greece. By autumn of 2014 the imbalance was down to €30 billion.

    In November 2014, capital flight from Greece started again and since then the Target2 imbalance has grown by €75 billion.

    The total Eurozone/ECB exposure is now at least €326 billion. In addition, private creditors are owed €70 billion.

    Then there are guarantees by the government on short term debt and debt owed by GSEs.

    Europeans seem blind to rescue facts.

    Rescue Facts:

    The 2010 rescue package was not for Greece but for the eurozone itself. Eurozone and Greek taxpayers were used to save the euro system. This was a despicable act.

    The ECB has kept things going by providing liquidity from the “beer drinking” part of the eurozone to the “wine drinking part”.

    Huge imbalances within the eurozone are now a fact, and they are growing thanks to Draghi’s QE.

    I watched a debate on Greece on French TV yesterday. They are all clueless as to what is really happening. I also spoke to a Dutchman yesterday and he said he was not concerned about Greece because Dutch exposure was only €5 billion. He almost fell over when I told him it’s more like €50 billion. Dutch exposure to the whole eurozone is €120 billion. I did not tell him that as I did not want to provoke a heart attack.

    • df NJ

      Meanwhile, there’s over 30% unemployment for Greeks under 40. At some point we have to stop blaming the unemployed as being lazy and start figuring out a way to create more opportunities for good paying jobs. The criminal banksters are raping the people and the rule of law is non-existent.

      • joe oberr

        Another reason for the high unemployment are the payroll, unemployment taxes and job protection laws that raise the cost to hire and keep
        an employee. ALL gov’ts are great at
        this as it makes the politicians look so “compassionate” to have such things as
        unemployment insurance and social (in)security programs which require payroll
        deductions as there are many more voting employees than employers. But what most employees do not realize is that there is no free lunch and everyone in every country would be better off not having these gov’t run programs which basically makes the country as a
        whole poorer and the gov’t and its employees richer at the expense of the private sector which struggles against the weight of the public sector and increased taxes and regulations. Portugal
        and Italy, I believe, even have laws prohibiting or making it extremely difficult to fire an employee after working for two or three years, so employers are naturally very hesitant to hire new employees which contributes to the high
        unemployment rate. Germany’s
        unemployment rate has been dropping since 2005 when big changes were made
        including the cutting of unemployment benefits and allowing part time workers. When
        one’s basic human right to life and freedom are constrained by laws, even those that appear to be “compassionate”, the standard of living in a country will go down. An employer should be able to hire and fire at will without the interference of a politician meddling in his
        decision and without having to pay mandated employee benefits . This was, after all, how it was in this country until the 1930’s.

  • CharlesH

    With all the hoops that Greece is going to have to jump through to appease the EU – I have to think it would be far better if Greece just told the EU to pack sand, declare themselves bankrupt, start printing their drachmas and let the chips fall where they may. Greece will have a hard time at first – but if it’s something the government AND the people want – they can do it and be successful. Exiting the EU has to be way better than perpetual slavery.

  • huththa

    Greece has a cunning plan. They are going to switch from the Euro to the Gyro. The gluttonous Germans and Finns will not be able to resist, they will buy up a trillion Gyros and suddenly Greece will not only be solvent, but calling the shots!

  • Richard O. Mann

    Man, this is so much better than the soaps on TV these days. Scary thing is, this is real life, and the whole world is going to be effected by it.

  • underaged

    Greece is broke. It does not matter what currency they use to quantify the red ink. Broke is Broke. Greece will have banks no matter what currency resides in vaults or appears on spreadsheets. Banks is Banks. Greece needs to reform its tax and spend habits regardless of any currency decision. Anyone with half a brain understands this and is trying to approach the problem from that point of view. Emotional speculation as to the power politics, hidden agendas. ‘he says’ or ‘she says’ is just that – pointless emotional speculation. Go ahead and look for the devil hiding behind a bar of gold or under a stack of Euros – endless drama to sell clicks.

    • df NJ

      As long as the German banksters steal all the Greek retirement money the deal is accepted. Otherwise, Tsipras will meet an untimely death.

  • M.Smith

    Same thing is happening along pacifc seacoast of Canada. I read an article just the other day about how ridiculous home prices have gotten in Vancouver and the surrounding areas due to demand/speculation from foreign entities. Hidden deep in the multi page article was a single paragraph stating that, while there were no “official” numbers, all of the realtors interviewed for the article stated that more than 80% of their current customer base was Chinese.
    I think some of the established, and newly, wealthy Chinese upper class are setting up their own versions of a Get Out of Dodge plan.

    • wisdomseeker

      Absolutely! The same is happening here in Auckland and I know that Australia’s big cities like Sydney and Melbourne are also affected. The NZ government allows anyone to purchase a home, there are no restrictions on foreign investment and that has priced a lot of NZ’ers out of the market which has made them tenants in their own backyard. Our government refuses to issue a house ownership register to see what percentage of houses are being bought by wealthy foreigners, namely wealthy chinese who are taking their cash out of the stock markets and parking it into real estate overseas. They dont really care how much they pay for a house, as long as they are able to park the cash elsewhere and this is causing a lot of problems in Auckland especially because wages haven’t risen to be able to sustain these new prices. You should see the news articles in the local media, its always about the auckland housing problem and the fact that locals have to constantly wage bidding wars with rich chinese who have only been in the country 24 hrs and don’t intend to stay here. Is terrifying and sickening at the same time that sadly many locals will not be able to win the bidding war and will have to resort to becoming tenants in their own country!
      NZ is going to become a severely wrecked economy if this housing bubble bursts!

  • tacoma

    I totally disagree with Michael characterization.

    When an EU country joins the Eurozone currency union it signs onto a treaty with many obligations. The treaty does not contain any provision to bailout anything. Greece has repeatedly and grossly violated terms of being a EU member and Eurozone member. Greece in addition has defaulted on IMF loans. Greece held a referendum that politically rejects terms of the last loan.

    Greece owes much to Germany, France, Italy, significantly to Spain and the UK. All these have a big say, not just Germany. All Eurozone members have a vote on all decisions on Greece. The latest offer contains a new authorized provision – suspension.

    The Eurozone has extended more than Eu300 billion to Greece in exchange for nothing. Not even a vote of thanks as the referendum shows. Greece has proven by its actions to be a failed state. It no longer qualifies to be in the EU and Eurozone. Germany and others will lose a great deal of money, and they have done all that can be done.

  • tacoma

    What significant is not millions of Chinese now wealthy enough to park their cash in overseas real estate. They have invested billions in hot safe spots like Singapore, London, Vancouver & Toronto, and Auckland. What significant is they have not invested in America despite record low prices and excess properties.

  • Mondobeyondo

    As many times as that can’s been kicked down the road, you’d think European politicians would have sore toes.

  • http://www.theofruendt.com/ Theo Frundt

    Michael, its even more simple: its about NATO, Bosporus, Turkey. Greece would be almost debt free if they are selling all their silly war toys to some of “our bad guys”, – some of the end-user certifications/agreements have already run out, other like for the Leo’s II will this and next year. Greece will never leave the European Union, even if the people would like to do so. The Syriza Project is now dead!

  • SunnyFlaSnotress

    Good, bad, or merely doomed, it’s still a deal.

  • immxdmta4

    @MichaelfromTheEconomicCollapse:disqus what is the reason for wanting to boot Greece from the EU? I understand all that is happening, financially, and with the globalists (at least to the best of my ability) but can’t see what purpose is served to get a Grexit? Does the EU want Greece to align with Russia? I’ve read that Russia is offering Greece help.
    I’ve also read that Italy, Spain, and other EU countries aren’t far behind Greece so what happens to them?

  • Bob332

    Pal, your head is STILL up your ass. Do your freakin homework. WHO increased the national debt to almost 19 TRILLION, ( it was about 8.5 when Bush left); WHO now has OVER 93 MILLION people out of work; WHO now has 44 MILLION receiving food stamps. Yeah, blame Bush for everything. When your 80 y.o. you’ll still be blaming Bush. Lib-tards like you NEVER accept responsibility. It always the other person’s fault. Grow some ball’s and a freakin spine!

    • Gerry Keefe

      And the debt was raised to those ridiculous levels to BAIL OUT BUSH !!!! You low-life Repukelicans always want to walk away scott-free from the financial ruin you impose on the rest of us. You couldn’t run a popcorn stand without stealing all the money and destroying everyone around you. BUSH was president when the country went down the toilet in 2008, so take responsibility for that you racist, hatemonger. Plus all the veterans who came back injured from Bush/Cheney’s War. Go thump your Bible, load your gun and vote for Trump and Exxon in the next election. Obama and Hillary as*hole !!!!! The future !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      • Bob332

        Funny, your Messiah Obozo NEVER had a real job. Should be cleaning toilet’s at an airport in Kenya.

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