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The Tip Of The Iceberg Of The Coming Retirement Crisis That Will Shake America To The Core

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RetirementThe pension nightmare that is at the heart of the horrific financial crisis in Detroit is just the tip of the iceberg of the coming retirement crisis that will shake America to the core.  Right now, more than 10,000 Baby Boomers are hitting the age of 65 every single day, and this will continue to happen every single day until the year 2030.  As a society, we have made trillions of dollars of financial promises to these Baby Boomers, and there is no way that we are going to be able to keep those promises.  The money simply is not there.  Yes, I suppose that we could eventually see a “super devaluation” of the U.S. dollar and keep our promises to the Baby Boomers using currency that is not worth much more than Monopoly money, but as it stands right now we simply do not have the resources to do what we said that we were going to do.  The number of senior citizens in the United States is projected to more than double by the middle of the century, and it would have been nearly impossible to support them all even if we weren’t in the midst of a long-term economic decline.  Tens of millions of Americans that are eagerly looking forward to retirement are going to be in for a very rude awakening in the years ahead.  There is going to be a lot of heartache and a lot of broken promises.

What is going on in Detroit right now is a perfect example of what will soon be happening all over the nation.  Many city workers stuck with their jobs for decades because of the promise of a nice pension at the end of the rainbow.  But now those promises are going up in smoke.  There has even been talk that retirees will only end up getting about 10 cents for every dollar that they were promised.

Needless to say, many pensioners are extremely angry that the promises that were made to them are not going to be kept.  The following is from a recent article in the New York Times

Many retirees see the plan to cut their pensions as a betrayal, saying that they kept their end of a deal but that the city is now reneging. Retired city workers, police officers and 911 operators said in interviews that the promise of reliable retirement income had helped draw them to work for the City of Detroit in the first place, even if they sometimes had to accept smaller salaries or work nights or weekends.

“Does Detroit have a problem?” asked William Shine, 76, a retired police sergeant. “Absolutely. Did I create it? I don’t think so. They made me some promises, and I made them some promises. I kept my promises. They’re not going to keep theirs.”

But Detroit is far from an isolated case.  As Detroit Mayor Dave Bing said the other day, many other cities are heading down the exact same path…

“We may be one of the first. We are the largest. But we absolutely will not be the last.”

Yes, Detroit’s financial problems are immense.  But other major U.S. cities are facing unfunded pension liabilities that are even worse.

For example, here are the unfunded pension liabilities for four financially-troubled large U.S. cities

Detroit: $3.5 billion

Baltimore: $680 million

Los Angeles: $9.4 billion

Chicago: $19 billion

When you break it down on a per citizen basis, Detroit is actually in better shape than the others…

Detroit: $7,145

Baltimore: $7,247

Los Angeles: $8,437

Chicago: $13,355

And many state governments are in similar shape.  Right now, the state of Illinois has unfunded pension liabilities that total approximately $100 billion.

There are some financial “journalists” out there that are attempting to downplay this problem, but sticking our heads in the sand is not going to make any of this go away.

According to Northwestern University Professor John Rauh, the total amount of unfunded pension and healthcare obligations for retirees that state and local governments across the United States have accumulated is 4.4 trillion dollars.

So where are they going to get that money?

They are going to raise your taxes of course.

Just check out what is happening right now in Scranton, Pennsylvania

Scranton taxpayers could face a 117 percent increase in taxes next year as the city’s finances continue to spiral out of control.

A new analysis by the Pennsylvania Economy League projects an $18 million deficit for 2014, an amount so massive it outpaces the approximate $17 million the struggling city collects annually

A 117 percent tax increase?

What would Dwight Schrute think of that?

Perhaps you are reading this and you are assuming that your retirement is secure because you work in the private sector.

Well, just remember what happened to your 401k during the financial crisis of 2008.  During the next major stock market crash, your 401k will likely get absolutely shredded.  Many Americans will probably see the value of their 401k accounts go down by 50 percent or more.

And if you have stashed your retirement funds with the wrong firm, you could end up losing everything.  Just ask anyone that had their nest eggs invested with MF Global.

But of course most Americans are woefully behind on saving for retirement anyway.  A study conducted by Boston College’s Center for Retirement Research found that American workers are $6.6 trillion short of what they need to retire comfortably.

That certainly isn’t good news.

On top of everything else, the federal government has been recklessly irresponsible as far as planning for the retirement of the Baby Boomers is concerned.

As I noted yesterday, the U.S. government is facing a total of 222 trillion dollars in unfunded liabilities.  Social Security and Medicare make up the bulk of that.

At this point, the number of Americans on Medicare is projected to grow from a little bit more than 50 million today to 73.2 million in 2025.

The number of Americans collecting Social Security benefits is projected to grow from about 56 million today to 91 million in 2035.

How is a society with a steadily declining economy going to care for them all adequately?

Yes, we truly are careening toward disaster.

If you are not convinced yet, here are some more numbers.  The following stats are from one of my previous articles entitled “Do You Want To Scare A Baby Boomer?“…

1. Right now, there are somewhere around 40 million senior citizens in the United States.  By 2050 that number is projected to skyrocket to 89 million.

2. According to one recent poll, 25 percent of all Americans in the 46 to 64-year-old age bracket have no retirement savings at all.

3. 26 percent of all Americans in the 46 to 64-year-old age bracket have no personal savings whatsoever.

4. One survey that covered all American workers found that 46 percent of them have less than $10,000 saved for retirement.

5. According to a survey conducted by the Employee Benefit Research Institute, “60 percent of American workers said the total value of their savings and investments is less than $25,000”.

6. A Pew Research survey found that half of all Baby Boomers say that their household financial situations have deteriorated over the past year.

7. 67 percent of all American workers believe that they “are a little or a lot behind schedule on saving for retirement”.

8. Today, one out of every six elderly Americans lives below the federal poverty line.

9. More elderly Americans than ever are finding that they must continue working once they reach their retirement years.  Between 1985 and 2010, the percentage of Americans in the 65 to 69-year-old age bracket that were still working increased from 18 percent to 32 percent.

10. Back in 1991, half of all American workers planned to retire before they reached the age of 65.  Today, that number has declined to 23 percent.

11. According to one recent survey, 70 percent of all American workers expect to continue working once they are “retired”.

12. According to a poll conducted by AARP, 40 percent of all Baby Boomers plan to work “until they drop”.

13. A poll conducted by CESI Debt Solutions found that 56 percent of American retirees still had outstanding debts when they retired.

14. Elderly Americans tend to carry much higher balances on their credit cards than younger Americans do.  The following is from a recent CNBC article

New research from the AARP also shows that those ages 50 and over are carrying higher balances on their credit cards — $8,278 in 2012 compared to $6,258 for the under-50 population.

15. A study by a law professor at the University of Michigan found that Americans that are 55 years of age or older now account for 20 percent of all bankruptcies in the United States.  Back in 2001, they only accounted for 12 percent of all bankruptcies.

16. Between 1991 and 2007 the number of Americans between the ages of 65 and 74 that filed for bankruptcy rose by a staggering 178 percent.

17. What is causing most of these bankruptcies among the elderly?  The number one cause is medical bills.  According to a report published in The American Journal of Medicine, medical bills are a major factor in more than 60 percent of the personal bankruptcies in the United States.  Of those bankruptcies that were caused by medical bills, approximately 75 percent of them involved individuals that actually did have health insurance.

18. In 1945, there were 42 workers for every retiree receiving Social Security benefits.  Today, that number has fallen to 2.5 workers, and if you eliminate all government workers, that leaves only 1.6 private sector workers for every retiree receiving Social Security benefits.

19. Millions of elderly Americans these days are finding it very difficult to survive on just a Social Security check.  The truth is that most Social Security checks simply are not that large.  The following comes directly from the Social Security Administration website

The average monthly Social Security benefit for a retired worker was about $1,230 at the beginning of 2012. This amount changes monthly based upon the total amount of all benefits paid and the total number of people receiving benefits.

You can view the rest of the statistics right here.

Sadly, most Americans are not aware of these things.

The mainstream media keeps most of the population entertained with distractions.  This week it is the birth of the royal baby, and next week it will be something else.

Meanwhile, our problems just continue to get worse and worse.

There is no way in the world that we are going to be able to keep all of the financial promises that we have made to the Baby Boomers.  A lot of them are going to end up bitterly disappointed.

All of this could have been avoided if we would have planned ahead as a society.

But that did not happen, and now we are all going to pay the price for it.

  • Syrin

    One of the worst side effects of social insecurity was that people decided they no longer had to live within their means and save for retirement. It’s certainly true of my parents and my in-laws. Living off the labor of your children violates my moral code for sure, and most retirees receive in benefits all they contributed on average in two years time. That’s another decade of benefits they milk off the system that they did NOT fund during their working years as life expectancy has increased markedly since these programs were started. The age at which one could receive their social insecurity should have been two years before the average life expectancy, and adjusted for gender. This number should have been adjusted every 3 years to account for the change over time.

    • tfb

      For the most part I TU this comment. One quibble I have with it is in the old days your folks lived in the house with you after they could no longer take care of themselves.

    • Obsolete

      Why couldn’t they just save money for the 30plus years they were working?

      I’m a milennial who doesn’t understand why my work earnings are taxed to be used for other people’s pensions. I’d rather have my tax money pay for welfare recipients who need the money because they can’t find a job.

  • kenfrombayside

    Guess what the democrats are obsessed with right now? Giving 11 – 30 million (nobody knows for sure) criminal lawbreakers legalization. Plus, they could sponsor their relatives; that would bring the total up to about 50 million aliens in our midst. Of course, these new citizens will vote for the vile democrats and their socialist giveaways. Most of them will be unskilled, uneducated, low IQ etc. Stop this outrageous bill now. Don’t sit on the sidelines.You are not wasting your time. The American people don’t want this bill. You have to do all you can do to stem the third world assault:
    – Contact your 2 US Senators and rep in congress.
    – after biz hours, leave a message on your DC rep’s voicemail. All US Senators have multiple offices so it would be a good idea to hit all of the. Remember, be civil and don’t threaten
    – go to NUMBERSUSA then go to the take action button. You will be able to send faxes to your 2 US Senators and congressional for free. (I also gave a $50 donation).
    – use Business Reply envelopes to state your opposition to America’s insane immigration policies and the proposed amnesty. Don’t give the parties any money.
    – join an immigration group like FAIR. Strength thru numbers!
    – go to the RNC & DNC sites to email them.
    – Use the media: call a talk radio program; write a letter to your local paper. If the media outlet is liberal, then talk about economic impact of massive third world immigration.
    – text everybody in your cell phone queue now.

    • Syrin

      They’re called undocumented democrats

    • Michael from Australia

      In Australia we have a similar problem with retirement & illegal “refugees”. Alot of them are just economic refugees, not political.

      Recently our prime minister Kevin Rudd made it policy that anybody who lands on Australian soil illegally will be sent to Papua New Guinea to live there, never to be settled in Australia. In Indonesia (who does nothing to stop the flow), alot of these “refugees” changed their mind after finding out that they won’t be able to go to Australia. Really they should be lucky Papua New Guinea will accept them.

      When they come here, they also receive what they have never worked for.

      In Nauru, mostly Iranian “refugees” destroyed the detention centre & caused 60 million dollars damage. (Nauru is our processing centre).

      Also here is another strange thing about Australia that you didn’t know:
      -our “Liberal” party is conservative & pro-Business.
      -and the people who want a republic, are progressive leftists.( unlike America’s republican). But one thing we do share is that we believe that all political parties are the same

      • Jennifer

        Sounds like you have a good, sensible prime minister. Wish we did. Our corrupt politicians want to open the flood gates and let anybody in.

      • DelmarJackson

        Immigration is destroying western countries for the benefit of a few groups that profit from immigration. Your Prime minister or his immigration policy will be stopped by the globalist multiculturalism worshippers and their cheap labor lobby friends.

  • Eddie Lutz

    Oh, the Baby Boners are “extremely angry” that they’re not going to get what was promised them? What can they do about it? Ride Harleys around with their angry faces? lol Screw them.

    • tfb

      Hear! Hear!
      Bunch of ex-hippies with their panties in a wad!

    • Obsolete

      We milennials were told if we took student loan debt and graduated with a degree we would get a job, but not in these times. We don’t even have Harleys.

      How could someone work for over 40 years in America and whine about not having any money saved up for retirement?

      • JoeD

        The problem is they are hypocrites of the highest order. They made a king’s ransom squandering the economy the economy away for a quick buck, then blame the younger generations on their inability to seize perceived opportunities that they were able to use to get ahead but no longer exist for most.

      • Susansayso

        Someone could work for over 40 years and could lose it all easily–a lot of people who had 401Ks that were invested in the stock market lost a lot when the market crashed. Now that the market is back up thanks to the Fed which has been printing money and buying back government securities, some fear that the government may try to confiscate those 401K funds?

    • Arno Krause

      Especially those Harleys that cost, and this is no joke because I’ve seen the sticker prices….as much as 45,000 dollars.

  • markthetruth

    Like the article says it’s not like the Pension wasn’t taken out of their paychecks. It’s that they stole the pension money for their special interest. I’m in a union and i get a letter by law telling me the Pension is Underfund when it reaches 77% or below . So we know in advance that there’s not enough workers to pay for all the retires.

    the end…

  • Tim

    On the consolidated balance sheet of the U.S. government, the second largest liability is Federal Employee and Veteran Benefits Payable. This line item consists of pension, post-retirement health and life insurance benefits for both civilian and military retirees. As of 9/30/12, this liability was $6.3 trillion. (It will be higher as of 9/30/13.) So how much of that $6.3 trillion liability does the federal government have? Zero! So this is just another component of the coming retirement crisis.

  • markthetruth

    Today the housing report was bad. But if you read the any

  • Byron

    Ludwig von Mises talked about Social Security in Human Action and how it is unsustainable; the government creates a “trust fund”, it gets filled with IOUs, and they never get paid back.

    Retirement programs need to be completely voluntary and up to choice. The problem is that the state uses its monopoly on violence to coerce people into paying for retirement programs that ultimately become Ponzi schemes. In the end, the individual is better at determining how to save for retirement than the state is.

    • Obsolete

      That’s the point! The baby boomers should have known about the Ponzi scheme years ago, but no, they had good paying jobs and spent their money on things they don’t need..and after 40 years of working..most have NOTHING in their name, nor do their children or children’s children could afford to care for them because of the economic crisis.

      If the government has no money to pay social security, why should younger generations have to pay for their pensions or lose jobs?

  • Bruce

    Do yourself a favor, crawl into bed and wait to die.

  • Chive Barnes

    The mean-spirited anger and spite of people is just amazing. Do we really want to be a society that refuses to provide a small stipend to the elderly so that they can simply survive? My mom is 80 and gets $1000 a month. This is far from enough to live on by itself.

    The problem is not Social Security. The under-funding of Social Security can easily be addressed. The problem is the outrageous pension promises made to Government Workers. Cops and Firemen retiring at 45 and getting $80,000 a year for life. The 10,000 or so retirees in the Calpers system that get well over $100,000 a year. The crony pay-off systems set up in local government where everybody score big except for the taxpayer.

    Direct your rage at the City, State and County workers who retire early and expect to live like Kings on the backs of the public, not at Granny and her measly $1000 a month.

    • Syrin

      Drop the bleeding heart crap. You all use that to pass the worst policies known to man. Human civilization after human civilization all over the planet for thousands of years did just fine without social insecurity. Let me play YOUR game.

      Do we really want a society that pays people to not work, to live off those who are working making their future prospects for prosperity dismal? Do we really want a society where one generation parasitizes the next and ruins the entire national economy for all future generations?

      • SongLady

        You haven’t mentioned the fact that we who expect to receive social security paid into it in the first place. i double checked my old check stubs, and, sure enough, I paid an average of $100/month into my social security account. I don’t want free money. I just would like to expect to get my own money back.

        • Obsolete

          We millenials can’t find good paying jobs do you see us behaving as fascists trying to destabilize the country for our own gain?
          If the government doesn’t have tax money to pay for your retirement, too bad. You voted for the government’s incompetence.
          Were milennials and 2000s kids reponsible for the stock market crash of 2008 or the unnecessary spending of monies of the treasury?

          • Susansayso

            No doubt the taxpayers will have to bail out the student loan mess with trillions in debt along with all the other trillions of dollars in debt that has been accumulated.

        • Steven

          Yea – you sure did pay into it. And then you completely ignored how the money was spent on other programs. You blew off the discussions and warnings and basic MATH that showed this was coming.
          sure would have been nice if you had actually cared 30 years ago.
          Oh, you want me to pay for your retirement – you use words like honor, ethics, and responsibility, while knowing SS won’t be there for me – but YOUR debt will be.

          • Tim

            Social Security withholdings are compulsory. She had nothing to do with the fact that the government has spent the money that working Americans have had confiscated withheld from their earnings. If there were a way to opt out of Social Security, I would most certainly do it. But there isn’t. I’ll be 38 next month, and I don’t expect to see any of the money that has been taken from me to keep the biggest Ponzi scheme on the planet going.

          • Ralfine

            Capitalism is a pyramid scheme, which is why continuous growth of the customer base is necessary. if not here, then abroad.

            Now start using cheap labour abroad to increase profit, and at the same time fire your home workers and reduce their disposable income.

            To protect your ships get the government buying a navy, and have the navy paid for by those workers you just fired.

          • Susansayso

            Socialism and communism are pyramid schemes in which corrupt leaders and their cronies at the top of the pyramid confiscate and control all the wealth while the masses struggle to survive. Look at every country where socialism and communism have been tried–they all eventually fail.

          • Ralfine

            Now I understand why people say we need to educate the women.

            As I said somewhere else here – you can’t try communism in one country.

            Communism comes after capitalism, when people get finally fed up with all the corrupt governments, lobbyists, arms manufacturers, wars, crisis, profit-over-life policies.

            In the world revolution all the people chuck away their governments and distribute the money bunkered at Cayman Islands.

            Basically, in Communism there won’t be a need for states, governments, borders, money.

            People like you and me will work on what we can do best. And in return we will get what we need for our lives from other people like you and me.

            There will be people who want to amass immense fortunes by not working. They will feel isolation creeping in.

            Wait another 500 years, maybe 783 years. But that’s the future.

          • Ralfine

            You know why the Eastern Bloc failed?

            The people believed your mass media, that your life is so much better than ours.

            That a job for everybody is bad, and the right to travel the world is so much better.

            So, when was the last time you visited Romania? Estonia? Peru? Scotland? Malta? Cuba?

            Money wasn’t that big an issue. Everybody had more than enough money.

            Everybody had a job, a home, a heated home, warm water every day, enough to eat every day, free school and university. Going to university only depended on your results from school, not on the wealth of your parents.

            But people wanted more.

            They could have travelled to the whole eastern bloc, but the wanted to travel elsewhere. And for that you needed dollars. And that was the problem.

            The western countries were not allowed to buy goods from the eastern bloc.
            Thus starving them of dollars, and making their population very unhappy.

            Companies dealing with the Eastern Bloc were punished heavily. So the East Bloc resorted to arms dealing and drugs dealing with the Third World and the CIA, and the mafia. Oh yes, there have been very shady deals just to get some dollars to buy a CT scanner for the children’s hospital, since it was on the embargo list.

          • Robert (qslv)

            Co Ops. The customer is also co-owner of the company and profits are distributed equally as dividends. I belong to three of these. One for my electric, one for telephone and one for Insurance. All business should be required to operate this way. Is this Capitalism or socialism?

          • Ralfine

            All societies produce the tools for their downfall.

            You can prohibit them, of course, just like you can prohibit camping in the city park.

            Not sure it helps, though.

            Collectives are quite old. The first ones come from the alps in the 15th century, building farm to market roads.

            Co-ops can be found in the Soviet Union as Kolkhoz, and in Israel as Kibbutz.And there are a lot of non-profit organizations.

            Wikipedia has an extensive article about cooperatives.

          • Steven

            Um, no one said it wasn’t compulsory. I said the Boomer generation did squat to safeguard their retirement while gov’t spent it.

            Most didn’t save enough to retire (live without income) for 30+ years, and to properly prepare to pay for 80% of their lifetime medical costs (80% of costs come in last 5 years of life), and they are now desperate to have the younger generation go into nation altering debt so they can leave the problem to us – knowing full well that same program won’t be there for us.

        • Bad_Mr_Frosty

          You trusted the government

          YOU LOSE!!

          • Susansayso

            Both political parties spent all the money–there is no Social Security Trust fund.

        • Ralfine

          To how many wars did you object?

          How do you think the government is buying bullets and fuel?

          And you always voted either Reps to start a war, or Dems to continue a war because they boys are already there?

          That’s where your pension went.

          And if you had been properly killed in Vietnam or Iraq, you wouldn’t have had that pension problem. Right?

          • 1voluntaryist

            Those who vote have no gripe. They helped create the mess. I have not voted or supported any govt. since I started working at 12 in 1954.

          • Jon Fisher

            We shouldn’t even have to vote to keep our rights as a free people. It’s so insane that many people can vote and for some reason those that don’t vote still have to take part in the system. This is why capitalism works so well. You vote (buy) for things you want and don’t vote (don’t buy) for things you don’t want. Normally, when one doesn’t buy they don’t have to partake, but when it comes to voting – whether you do it or not, the outcome is never always in your favor.

        • Reynaldo Neggle

          You didn’t just pay into, you handed your money over to crooks and then voted in more crooks every election. Crooks do what crooks do when you give them your money. I wouldn’t expect to ever see it again if I were you. Should it make you mad? Yeah, and it sure as heck makes me mad also. So what are you going to do about it?

        • Ralfine

          Did you try some math recently? If you paid $100/month for 40 years, that’s 48,000. which gives you a monthly pension of $1,000 for 4 years.

      • Obsolete

        How can someone work for 40 years and save NOTHING for retirement? This puzzles me.

        • john

          The answer is medical bills for most of us. You have a heart attack and need a stint, the cost with being in the hospital is $50,000, the cost of medicine is $400.00 per month (which most insurance companies will not pay). Obviously, you are young and have not had much life experience. There are many unexpected bills that come up and insurance usually leaves 20% up to you.

          • Reynaldo Neggle

            Yeah, but its because of direct subsidies to consumers through govt programs and insurance that health care costs that much. It’s just like what financial aid has done to college tuition. The banks want to lend more money, so they lobby the govt for higher student loans. The higher student loans means the schools can raise tuition. Tuition gets raised so the students need more money. The banks go back to Congress and lobby to have the loan rates raised again. And on and on. This is what subsidies do when the govt gets involved. Every entitlement program is a direct subsidy to the recipient.

          • Mondobeyondo

            A broken arm costs $15,000.

          • Krusty_From_Oz

            I am 64 in January. Last month I spent 7 days in hospital
            (Adelaide Australia) with pneumonia and pericarditis
            which is inflammation of the protective tissue surrounding the heart. Treatment included (in a private room) blood tests twice a day, blood cultures once a day, a CT scan, an ultra-sound, 2 lots of X-rays and three different specialists attending. On leaving hospital I had to
            pay a grand total of $178.00 AU ($167USD) total.
            You are being screwed in spades in the US. I think US citizens can still migrate meeting certain criteria. Cheers, Krusty.

        • MeMadMax

          The answer lies in the “entitlement society”… The boomers are one great big F YOU to mankind…

          • Ralfine

            You are entitled to nothing. If you dont have anything, dont blame us. work for it yourself.
            If you want streets, build them by yourself.


        • Mondobeyondo

          Depends on the individual, but for the fiscally ignorant, it’s not hard at all. Schools for the most part, don’t teach about basic individual finances. That’s SUPPOSED to be Mom and Dad’s job. Well guess what? Mom and Dad don’t teach them either!!

          So what’s a high school or college kid to do? Rack up the balance on that Mastercard or Visa, that’s what.

        • GSOB

          Stuff happens

    • bobcat

      Don’t fret Barnes. The public workers will take a haircut because cities, counties and states will not have the revenue to pay the pensions that were promised. It’s that simple.

      Nobody seemed to care about this back when there was plenty of money coming in. But after our high paying manufacturing base was outsourced, tax revenues fell off a cliff. The obligations you mention now stick out like a sore thumb.

      Detroit is only the first municipality to file bankruptcy. What plays out there will be repeated elsewhere.

    • Obsolete

      Public union workers get outrageous pensions..And some of these cougar teachers get a free pass when they are caught doing the 69 with students.

      What a sick world we live in.

    • Zoltanne

      Prior to the Communist implementation of The New Deal, America’s elderly were cared for — even lived with — family.

      The new American phenomenon is that everyone and their old mothers live independently — often in a single-person household. Now just how sustainable and sensible is THAT?

      If you don’t want to see your elderly mother subsisting on $1K a month, bring her into your own household. Didn’t she care for you when you were a young dependent person?

      • Ralfine

        $1K per month? That’s minimum wage for 12h per day, isn’t it?

        In England, minimum wage is £6.15/h.

        • Zoltanne

          Do we need to remind you why the Depression occurred?

          Do we need to remind you how many Americans still farmed and still fed themselves, their families, and their communities during that time?

          Do we need to point you to the numerous articles here that can substantiate these points?

          Or do you just want to churn-it-up on everyone’s post, troll-style?

          • Ralfine

            Yes, please remind me why the depression occurred and why the new deal occurred.

    • TK

      Couldn’t agree more.

      Let’s go with this route. The benefits and wages of public servants should be dictated by an average of the local tax payers. As a matter of fact, lets make it an average of the bottom 50% of tax payers.

      So in reality, when the average tax payer gets no retirement, neither does the public servant.

      When the average tax payer gets no health care, neither does the public servant.

      When the average tax payer gets no paid vacation, neither does the public servant.

      Now that would give our public servants an incentive to increase the local wages and benefits!!!

      • Ralfine

        Wages and salaries and benefits shall be negotiated between employers and employees. Except minimum wage. Minimum wage shall be high enough so that a full time employee does not need subsidies from the taxpayer for living, healthcare and sending his two kids to school.
        The public servants include congressmen and the president.

        How come they are all millionairs in the US? Is a millionaire the right representative of the average Joe?

      • GSOB


    • socialism sucks

      Yes. I want to deprive her of her stipend (unless of course, she contributed. Then I want her to have it back). But no extra. Nobody gets anything who didn’t put it. That’s what makes this a ponzi scheme. You take care of her. Not me!!!!!!!!!!! And in return, I will take care of me and not ask you for help

    • AS55423

      Some people I know that work for the govt think they should get 90% of their base pay this line of thinking is crazy.

    • Reynaldo Neggle

      This isn’t about just a small stipend to some poor old retired folk. We’re also on the hook for all the other entitlement programs, all of which are growing faster than the workforce is shrinking. Who is going to pay for all of that? Should it be my responsibility to bail out everyone that hits a speed bump in life? Especially since I wasn’t the one who put the speed bump there in the first place. The system is going to collapse anyway because all the people getting free govt swag now outnumber the rest of us, and they’re going to vote for more and more swag. Anyone who objects will be called a selfish, ungrateful tool of Fox News.

  • Rodster

    ‘The trouble with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people’s money’

    – Margaret Thatcher

    • Ralfine

      Nice quote, but so untrue.

      It is in capitalism, that people rely so heavily on other people’s money.
      Dividends come from exploitation.

      If shareholders wouldn’t steal the money, the company would have more for research to stay on top, and the workers wouldn’t need social security payments from the taxpayers.

      • Rodster

        Those that defend socialism and all good things coming from the State will find her comments appalling.

        It’s funny how a European seems to think he knows more about what broke Detroit. You sir are more dangerous than a low information voter. I think you need to move here and work for our main stream media. You would fit right in.

        Detroit was a victim of socialism and so are many other US municipalities. It’s all to do with the local Govt over-promising to it’s workers what’s against the laws of mathematics. “Hey, work for us and we’ll pay you 75% of your salary until you die”.

        And memo to Ralfine, anyone who is stupid enough to lend money to any govt needs to find another line of work.

        • AS55423

          Capitalism is no longer working due to the fact it’s now called soft fascism. Socialism isn’t working because they ran out of other people’s money. The whole system is coming down there won’t be any ism left.

          • markthetruth

            Senators again try to replace dollar bill with coin. (then the Five)

            Another step to force us to Digital Money, who’s gonna want to carry coins around .
            And a cashless Society. And track all money.

            the end…

          • ian

            it’s time for a new ‘ism’. duuhhh…..think outside the box, folks.

          • AS55423

            Enlighten us oh wise one ?

          • Jon Fisher

            Capitalism isn’t working anymore because, yes, it’s been tainted. When it becomes as it is now, it’s actually no longer capitalism – by sheer definition.

        • Ralfine

          Detroit shouldnt have bailed out the car industry, the state shouldnt have bailed out a single bank.

          They should have taxed them high to pay for the future homeless, high crime rate and decay.

          • Rodster

            The US govt bailed out Detroit, check your facts at the door.

          • Chloe

            And who is the government?

          • Spooner

            That makes sense steal some more, spoken by a true communo-fascist. Thats the problem you have a government dispensing “justice” but what you forget the government is made of people that produce nothing that the private sector can’t do and they are paid by stolen wealth – aka. taxes.

          • Ralfine

            Private police, army, justice and schools?
            And when you call the ambulance first lets hear your credit card number.

          • Susansayso

            Detroit has a well paid police force that is paid for with taxpayer money but good luck trying to get them to out after you call for help–it will be hours if they show up at all. It’s a similar situation in bankrupt cities across the U.S. (like Stockton, Ca and San Bernardino, Ca) It’s why neighbors are arming themselves and starting neighborhood watches. People are fed up with thugs (like Trayvon) who are stealing and attacking innocent people!

          • Ralfine

            Trayvon was an unarmed teenager, exercising his right to walk the streets.

            It was Zimmerman who was armed, and followed and attacked an under-aged boy.

            In other places a middle aged single man stalking a handsome teenager and getting a bloody nose would be treated as attempted child abuse.

          • Trulee

            Actually it was Trayvon who attacked Zimmerman. Trayvon was buying skittles and tea to make ‘Purple Drank’….he wanted to get high. He was a thug. The locals know this….the MSM does not report the facts.

          • Ralfine

            So, Trayvon attacked Zimmerman in his car while buying cough syrup and soda, and then Zimmerman was told by police to leave him alone?

          • 1voluntaryist

            Yes, yes, yes. Accountability. And you can be CERTAIN the ambulance will show up, not because you were promised it would by a politician, but because the company wants your money. That never fails. Govt. always fails, e.g., the citizen of Detroit can’t get services he paid for. You hated capitalism because it had inequality. You created socialism and got equality, i.e., everyone is equally screwed.

          • Ralfine

            You see, exactly that is what happens in China.

            Because you have to pay the ambulance, nobody calls an ambulance in a traffic accident.

          • 1voluntaryist

            Nobody? Really? What supports the crew? You mean “some” don’t call. Those who are not injured much and want to save. So the person who really needs it, gets it. It’s called “the free market”, and that’s the best allocation of scare resources.

          • Ralfine

            Those who are not injured much, get a taxi.

            Those who are home and have a heart attack and have enough cash, call the ambulance.

            It’s not who needs it most, it’s who is richest.

            It’s called free market.

            There is another rumour in China.

            If a driver only injures you slightly, he might kill you, to avoid witnesses and compensation. That’s why drivers leave their car with the crowbar in hand after an accident.

          • Jon Fisher

            This is a great comment, 1voluntaryist. Every company is out to better themselves, as is the customer going to the best company for their needs. It works for everyone, until the company has no incentive to better themselves, i.e., the State.

          • Jon Fisher

            Why yes, you would need to subscribe to an ambulance crew to get your needs. As you do now, though now you simply pay in the form of taxes. In this natural state of a free society, you would buy this service as you would any other. To think we need to have all the answers (right now) to how billing would work or how phone calls would take place is absurd. Just look at the fact now. People work in these industries, they get paid, and people get saved. Why would you think the hand of the State needs to be present for this to work elsewhere?

          • Ralfine

            Only those with money then deserve to have an ambulance or education?

          • Jon Fisher

            I shouldn’t have to ‘get a different government’. They are extracting my money. They don’t get my money first and then give me some of it back, like I’ve heard people say. It’s my money. The system came in and claimed a territory without proper rights. They take my money without my consent. I am correct in where I am, I don’t need to move elsewhere to (actually unavoidably) escape ‘tax laws’.

          • Ralfine

            You shouldn’t have to?

            Well, you are talking humans here.

            I shouldn’t have to find a second opinion from a different doctor, because every doctor should be properly trained.

            I shouldn’t have to find a different supplier because everyone should have properly learned in school and apprenticeship how to calculate, read, build houses, etc.

            I shouldn’t need to send criminals to jail, because nobody should be a criminal in the first place.

            Governments are no difference.

            You don’t like it, you change it. And there are laws that make that possible without getting yourself killed or imprisoned.

          • Jon Fisher

            You’re talking about things you aren’t forced to partake in. This is ENTIRELY different with a force that takes my money without asking.

            It’s your risk to be a human and go out in this world and get a doctor or supplier. You take that risk.

          • 1voluntaryist

            Voting for change is an illusion. If you hadn’t figured that out before, Obama should have wised you up.

          • Ralfine

            I’d have voted for the greens anyway.

          • Jon Fisher

            And actually, Spooner, to add on to what you are saying… The State doesn’t let the private sector build their operations. One guy a long time ago had a cheap and effective way to send mail across waters to other people, much cheaper than the State. They banned him from doing this, likely fined him, and sent the customers – by effect – to the slow, more expensive, State to send mail.

          • Mondobeyondo

            The U.S. government actually bailed out GM and Chrysler (Ford refused a bailout). It’s what the U.S. government is great at. Bailing out corporations and Wall Street banks, but not taxpayers.

          • 1voluntaryist

            Taxpayers don’t need a bailout. They just need to stop paying taxes. That would ensure their posterity would not face the same economic disaster. But for now, we have all been robbed and the money is gone. We have no one but ourselves to blame. We trusted govt. We were warned not to. We chose to believe that business was the enemy who had to be controlled by govt. Then govt. stabbed us in the back.

          • Jon Fisher

            I agree 100%, 1volutaryist. I assume by your very profile name that you are for a voluntary state of human existence. One where you aren’t being forced. Which is likely why you are probably a proponent and supporter of true capitalism.

          • Jon Fisher

            The State shouldn’t bail out anyone or anything. Companies fall and products cease to be produced when they naturally are no longer wanted.

            Tax shouldn’t play a role in this at all, because the State shouldn’t play a role at all in whether businesses fail or not. Again, when a business is in debt and can’t function, there’s a reason for that. The customers don’t want it anymore or they can’t sustain their company for whatever other reason. It all works out best in the end for the customer anyway. It has to – that’s what capitalism does.

        • Ralfine

          And you really think it is socialism when the state pays for an army to protect pipelines and super tankers?
          And then not even has much income from the pipeline and tankers?
          In socialism the state would own the pipelines, supertankers and arms manufacturers.

          • Rodster

            It was all about the Govt wanting to control how business was conducted, unionizing the public sector. The unions vote in govt officials. Rinse and repeat. Then the govt makes promises that go against basic math and the govt won’t say no to votes.

            If anyone (individual or business) loans money to any govt deserves what they get.

          • ArigatouGozaimas

            The state doesn’t have to own the corporation directly. They can be tied together through complex taxation, subsidies, regulation, cooperative projects, bribes, indirect political control, etc. Once the state feels something is only owned via the permission of said state, it is essentially socialism. The funny thing is, it can still be referred as capitalism if there is at least a sense of private ownership. But in reality it is masked socialism. The corporate people and the state people begin to mesh together. They all take the form of pigs. (Animal Farm)

            The process completes itself as smaller enterprises are shut out of the system or absorbed; .

            This system of state and business relationship involving a military-industrial complex used to be called national socialism or fascism. Today there really is no name for it.

            For now, I prefer to call it aristocratic socialism, as the elite in business and government form the new aristocracy and effectively work to disable upward mobility among the less privileged. Instead, they strive to create dependency on their power.

          • Ralfine

            In socialism the profit of state owned companies pays for education, healthcare, army, police, street lighting, street cleaning, infrastructure construction, medicine, etc.
            Socialism only crashes through theft and especially arms race- spending money needed for education and healthcare on useless weapons to protect against the threat of those who make huge private profits by selling the newest weapons systems to the taxpayer.

          • Susansayso

            Socialism always crashes as the corrupt leaders run out of other people’s money. Socialist leaders eventually run out of other people to blame once socialism begins to crash.

          • Ralfine

            And why did monarchies crash?

          • 2Gary2

            faux news talking points. Can you do any original thinking?

          • 1voluntaryist

            The taxpayer doesn’t buy the weapons, the govt. does. A govt. that represents itself, as all rulers do. The taxpayer pays and suffers until he can’t pay anymore because the economy collapses. Then some private enterprise is allowed until a little wealth is built up. A re-set is done and the whole scam (govt.) starts again.

          • Ralfine

            The taxpayer puts the government in place by either voting for them or not voting at all (don’t care who rules)

            Actually, shareholders siphon off much more money than governments.
            And if you hold lots of shares and siphon off lots of money from the economy, you don’t even need to pay tax.

            Currently there are 30 trillion dollars stored on offshore bank accounts, Removing that capital from the economy, forcing governments to print more money to keep the economy going.

            Except in Greece, which is firmly embedded in the EU and therefore not allowed to print money at will.
            The EU is forcing Greece to cut down on government employees, with expected results.

            But this is just cosmetics. Even the EU does not address the real issue of the crisis: over production by profit hungry capitalists, underpayment of workers and siphoning off of capital into private bank safes away from the economy.

          • 1voluntaryist

            Every state exploits. No state recognizes individual sovereignty. The way to stop it is to not vote, not give away your power for security. Only you can protect you. Govt. is a world wide scam and paper money/central bank its tools.

          • Ralfine

            If nobody votes but 1, then the one who gets that 1 vote (100% of the votes) will rule.

            If you do not vote, you signify you do not care who rules.

            If you neither like democrats nor republicans then you still have the choice of about 30 other parties in the US.

            Neither of them may win, but the total number of given votes gets bigger, and the percentage of votes to dems or reps will get smaller.

            And some day, there might be even a party that has more votes than dems or reps.

            Right now there are about 60-70% non-voters (not-giving-a-damn) in the US. And the result is the government you have.

            Every nation has the government it deserves.

            Voting might not change anything, but it may provoke TPTB to show their face.
            Which in turn may change majorities.

          • Jon Fisher

            Voting is a scam because not everyone can be happy, like in true capitalism. I don’t care if everyone on this planet voted for one ruler. If I didn’t, in a voting system, I have no say.

          • Ralfine

            In true capitalism everyone can be happy?

            Please define capitalism.
            Please define true capitalism.

            In my book capitalism is where the CAPITAL rules, hence the name.
            And humans are just a means to multiply the capital.

            Now, how can everybody be happy in places where he is just used up?

          • Jon Fisher

            Everyone CAN be happy, but not everyone will. No system, or lack thereof, can make everyone happy. That’s wishful thinking because we are all not the same.

            Capitalism is when people are free to make their decisions as to the services and products they subscribe to. It’s when humans and humans interact in the natural form without a governing body explaining how they want the interactions to go.

            So what are you getting at with CAPITAL? Of course, the way to exchange goods and services short of bartering is to pay one another in an easier form of wealth that can be used to buy things we want (but aren’t forced to buy :D).

            I’m not understanding your last paragraph.

            You know, I’m not even sure why we are commenting back and forth. I don’t agree with war, so I don’t want to pay for it. I don’t agree with everything the government does, so I don’t want to fund anything. You do. It’s that easy.

          • Ralfine

            I don’t agree with war either, so I vote for a different party.

            Capital isn’t just money. Machines are capital too.

            If you don’t have capital, you can’t open a business.

            If you don’t have money, you can’t buy things.

            So, don’t tell me everyone has the choice what to buy.

            In China old people kill themselves, so that their children do not need to buy medicine for them, but can use the money to study.

          • 1voluntaryist

            I don’t care who rules! I reject rulers, the concept of govt. A benign ruler is an oxymoron. Voting gives permission to rule. I have been resisting that since the first day I realized I was being ruled in 1954, at age 12.

          • Ralfine

            Whatever, be unhappy all your life. Your choice.

            Anyway, you are lucky. Your days being ruled are over soon.

            BTW, how would you like communism or anarchy?

          • 1voluntaryist

            Obedience would not make me happy. It is not in my character. The fact that you assume unhappiness with disobedience tells me your mindset. I am an anarchist. Anarchy is necessary for freedom, but not enough. Respect for individual sovereignty is required. I have been happy only because I did not adopt the values of the surrounding culture.

          • Ralfine

            You cannot be disobedient all the time.

            You have to adopt some form of value of your surrounding culture.

            If you drive in America, it would be unhealthy to drive on the left hand side on the road. Or walking across the motorway.

            And when the doctor tells you it would be helpful to drink a lot you can choose not to drink anything at all because you don’t accept any rule. But you won’t get far.

          • Jon Fisher

            But the thing is, and this is where a vast misunderstanding takes place, people think things would go haywire without a ruling force called the State. The ruling force, however, is everyone together. For example, I won’t drive against traffic because it would be in my own self interest to save my life and property. Therefore, I don’t do that. I don’t drive on the ‘right’ side of the road just because that’s the law. Similarly, just because the law says not to smoke drugs doesn’t mean I won’t do it. I do what I find to work best for me – not what the State says.

          • 1voluntaryist

            I have gotten far. And also lived to 70. You keep twisting everything I say to justify your compromises. My life is proof that you can live free in an unfree world. But you have to use your mind, be innovative, and courageous.

          • Ralfine

            So, what’s your problem then?

            Freedom starts in the head, no matter who rules.

            You can’t choose the time when you are born or the place where to grow up.

            You arranged yourself in your world, I arranged myself in my world.

            And in beteween was the iron curtain.
            You don’t have my experience, I don’t have your experience. But at least we can communicate now.

          • 1voluntaryist

            I was 23 before I realized I was not alone. I discovered Ayn Rand. Since I have found many others. I would guess our numbers at less than 1% that would change if we had our own community. Peace and prosperity is conducive to reproduction.

          • Jon Fisher

            I think there are more than that. Just look at Mises and Lew Rockwell. Many, many people are on the same page there.

          • Chloe

            Socialism IS theft!

          • Ralfine

            Socialism is allowing you to walk the street without having to pay for its use every time.

            Socialism is allowing you to breathe clean air without having you paying for its cleaning.

            You want to pay for everything?


          • Robert (qslv)

            So who pays for it? Me! Enjoy your free streets and air, Ralfine.

          • 1voluntaryist

            YES, REALLY! I want to pay my way. Socialism promises a free ride and screws you.

          • Ralfine

            Let me tell you a little story.

            I worked in China for some time, right after China introduced Manchester Capitalism, but kept the state in the hands of the aristocracy.

            Siemens was building the Subway there. A worker tripped and hit his head. He was brought to the hospital, but the guy who brought him there didn’t have enough cash with him.

            So the worker was left without any attention until some cash was brought to the hospital.

            He died.

            In Hong Kong you find a structure Americans may describe as socialism.

            Hospital treatment is free to all citizens. Ambulances bring casualties to public hospitals. You only have to pay HK$100 for A&E to keep the area clear for those who need emergency treatment.
            60% of Hong Kong’s population doesn’t pay any tax.

          • Jon Fisher

            Air is clean, retard. No need to pay for it’s processing. You think governments of the world gather all their tax money and use it to filter your golden air?

          • Ralfine

            Air is clean?

            Really? There is no smog in the US?

          • Jon Fisher

            Be it clean or not, it doesn’t quite matter to me. Yet, again, I have to pay for it. It’s absurd.

            If I choose to save my money and breathe in toxins, I should be allowed. But the State doesn’t let that happen. They force me yet again. Like everything else.

          • Ralfine

            Well, you are free to change everything and mold the world in your image.

          • Jon Fisher

            You would say the exact same thing about walking on streets if governments were the creators and sustainers of shoe manufacturing. ‘Well, without shoes, you would get injured and possibly die. People couldn’t walk around without shoes! Are you kidding?!” Well, we see the private sector does in fact make shoes. They can make roads too.

          • Ralfine

            Yes, and they put up boards:
            “Private road, do not trespass”

            Next time you see one when you open your door.

          • Jon Fisher

            So I should be forced to pay for your roads (as current – if we lived in the same location) because you don’t want to be without them? I shouldn’t be forced to pay for anything at all. And that’s precisely what you’re advocating. Is forcing me to do that which I don’t want to do. That is insane, my friend.

          • Ralfine

            You don’t need to pay for them if you don’t use them.

            But if you “steal” them, you get punished.
            “steal” = unauthorized use, using a service without paying for it.

            Same goes for sewage. And make sure your septic tank does not overflow and poisons my ground water.

            Anyway, you can choose your own road building company and your own sewage company. And you can blame them if they do not give you the road and sewage disposal you desire.

            Latest when you sue them for not providing you the road, (because there is no more space for another road), that will be the last road building company you get to make business with.

            But feel free to find a different one.

          • Jon Fisher

            But I still have to pay for the State roads as of now even if I don’t use them?

            I’ll answer that – Yes.

          • Ralfine

            I was talking of a fictive place, where you have a place to live and your neighbours surrounded your place with their roads already before you were born.

          • Jon Fisher

            Then you would probably want to leave if you don’t like that.

            I think a simple thing can be said for governments. I don’t want them, yet they take my things without a written contract signing over my wealth. It’s as simple as that. It is theft. There is no other plausible explanation.

            If a store gave me poor quality eggs and then extracted money from my bank to pay for the eggs I didn’t ask for nor want, it’s theft.

          • Ralfine


            Didn’t you say “You shouldn’t have to leave if you don’t like it there?”

            So, what is it?

            You know what the Chinese say?
            There is no point to discuss things you cannot change – like governments or the weather.
            Discuss instead how to make money and be happy.

          • 1voluntaryist

            “…feel free…”? No one is free when govt. exists.

          • Ralfine

            Then get rid of that government. What is hindering you?
            Don’t you have the same right to get rid of them, as their right to get rid of you?

            Use your right of free speech, the right to protest, the right to pray to whomever you want.

            All people have the government they deserve.

          • Jon Fisher

            That’s just the thing. The government by nature cannot exist to support everyone they coerce. You think everyone enjoys the government they are wrapped up in? No. Definitely not. The reason one doesn’t shop at Walmart is because they don’t like the store, the people, or the products – and that’s fine because they no longer have to associate with them.

            We can’t do that with governments. And if we didn’t want any government at all, that’s not possible.

            Plus, man was here before the State. So the State is the intruder. No need for the occupants of a land to leave because a bacteria infiltrated it. The disease needs to leave.

          • Ralfine

            “We can’t do that with governments.”

            Yes, you can.

            I live in the 4th or 5th country since my birth. Everywhere you have different freedoms.

          • 1voluntaryist

            NOT ALL! Under mob rule (democracy), 49% can be oppressed. If I knew of one society where I could live free I would move there. I have spoken out and resisted govt. since 1954.

          • Ralfine

            Well, did you try the moon?

          • 1voluntaryist

            I said society. Otherwise I would have found an uninhabited island. Some families do live in the outback just to be left alone. I might try Galt’s Gulch, Chile.

          • Ralfine

            If you have society, you have rules you have to follow, even if it is just: “Eat your own food”
            “Don’t bother me when you are sick”
            “Take care of yourself”

            “Don’t walk around naked in your garden”
            (This last rule is interesting.)

          • 1voluntaryist

            Survival depends on obeying nature. Freedom does not mean a disconnect from reality. It means being able to live by your own mind, not under duress (do it or die) from a ruling elite. That’s what democracy always means, as the elite never admits they are looking after themselves first.

          • Ralfine

            Sorry, don’t quite follow you.

            If someone tells you he will shoot you for trespassing, will you follow his rule or will you be disobedient to keep your freedom (for the next 5 seconds)?

          • 1voluntaryist

            “If the govt. wouldn’t regulate…” That argument was refuted thousands of years ago. But if I concede people are too stupid to live or too evil and therefore have to be controlled, how does voting magically select only the “good” and the smart? And if a mistake is made by the guy in charge, he is not the only one who suffers, we all do because we gave him a monopoly on morality and force.

            As for not trespassing, it is contradictory for me to want my rights & not respect rights in general (property). Follow me now?

          • Ralfine

            Are you familiar with the concept of locust swarms?

          • Ralfine

            Oh, but you can walk around without shoes. My boyfriend had his first shoes in highschool, And when I was a kid, we usually ran around barefoot until broken glass made this dangerous.

            Shoes are single, personal items.

            Streets are a bit different. Imagine a highrise building with 2000 people living inside – would you propose that everyone of them could have his own street to the entrance?

          • 1voluntaryist

            Today, fascism is called state capitalism, or crony capitalism. True capitalism is the free market, no govt. interference. It has never existed anywhere, but it takes the blame for govt. failures.

          • 1voluntaryist

            A.G.: Very perceptive. A half century ago Ayn Rand called the American system: The Aristocracy of Pull.

          • Susansayso

            And when the state owns everything, only the corrupt leaders and their cronies get most of the wealth. All pigs are equal, but some pigs are more equal than others.

          • Ralfine

            It is very interesting how deeply the American Mass Media have penetrated the minds of the populace.

            America has led a quite isolated life for many years and even centuries.

            Now the Internet gives the Americans the opportunity to get into interaction with people from the other side of the globe, and not just through wars and occupation.

            This will eventually lead to a profound change in the mindset of many people. And not only in America. Non-Americans will also get a very different insight into Americans that is not portrayed by American mass media.

            America is very similar to the Soviet Union and North Korea.
            Isolated for ages by their own government. One-sided indoctrination — Christianity is good, everything else is evil. Everybody should only care about himself. Which isn’t really what Jesus taught.
            Thus screwing up the minds of most and get them fighting each other, so that the elites are undisturbed in lining their own pockets.

            And yes, YOU also will have a chance to line your own pockets, so don’t fight us, instead, participate in cheating your neighbour and you will be rich one day.

          • 1voluntaryist

            Oh Ralfine, you had me agreeing with you right up until “…cheating your neighbor…”. Socialism is dog eat dog. Capitalism requires cooperation. A business must satisfy customers or perish. You would know that if you had ever run a small business. Every socialist nation is made possible by the grey/black market. There is where wealth is CREATED, not stollen. The concept of wealth creation is foreign to socialists who see all property as theft. The guy that promises to do away with property if you put him in power is the guy that will do away with your property and make it his. Wake up.

          • Ralfine

            A small business needs to find paying customers.

            A monopoly dictates to customers.

            Did you read Marx or Engels? According to them, capitalism is NEEDED to create wealth.

            In Socialism you needed to know people to barter with. Try cheating someone in the black market and next time your customer might be an undercover policeman.

            In capitalism cheating is usually permitted if it is written somewhere in the small print. Then the law will protect the cheater.

            In the UK loan sharks asking for over 1000% interest rates even advertise on TV.

          • 1voluntaryist

            I read Marx & Engels in 1955. I could tell at 13 they were wrong. A monopoly is the creation of the state. It can not exist in a free market. Loan sharks don’t put a gun to anyone’s head like the state. Don’t like paying 1K%? Don’t borrow. If people didn’t choose to use the service, they would go out of business.

          • Jon Fisher

            Perfekt, mein Freund.

          • Ralfine

            You read Marx at 13? Which books? And where exactly did he go wrong?

          • 1voluntaryist

            Yes, one form of socialism is communism, i.e., state ownership, direct control. The other is indirect control, the illusion of private property, i.e., fascism. Take your choice, both fail. You can’t have govt. and freedom, e.g., property or civil rights.

          • Ralfine

            Fascism is capitalism combined with aggressive nationalism.

            Nothing to do with socialism.
            Actually, in all fascist regimes communists and socialists are imprisoned and killed first.

            In Socialism production facilities are owned by the state, not the government.
            The state being the “holding” of the nation, the government being the board of directors of the state.

            In Communism everybody owns all production facilities, everybody is an entrepreneur and behaves as such.
            No state is necessary to protect the property of the few from the masses.

            Therefore no government either.

            Communism is the logical development, or evolution if you will, after capitalism.

            Because capitalism will eventually stand in its own way.

            As we currently see, capital concentrated in a few hands and then bunkered on the Cayman Islands, does not contribute to sales and therefore stifles the economy.

            Governments in failing societies are always doing the wrong things. They do more of what the did in the past, because doing the opposite was taught as being evil.

            But doing more of the same that brought you into crisis will only amplify the crisis.

            In technical systems, positive feedback will lead to the destruction of the system.

          • Chloe

            That would be Communism

          • Ralfine

            “the company would have more for research to stay on top, and the workers
            wouldn’t need social security payments from the taxpayers.”

            THAT would be communism?

            So capitalism is when you work for Acme Ltd, their shareholders pocket the money, and you get paid by the taxpayer to stay alive.

            You are right. That is what is happening right now.

          • 2Gary2

            sounds like the wal mart business model

          • 1voluntaryist

            “…not…much income…”? You are not counting all the campaign money and under to table payouts. Socialism has two (2) forms: 1. Fascism 2.Communism. Neither work.

          • Ralfine

            Fascism isn’t a form of Socialism, it’s a form of capitalism.

            And we don’t know whether communism will work, because there is no experience.

        • Ralfine

          Banks live splendedly from lending to the government, because the government does not need to spend their own money for repayment plus interest, but your money. And when the banks spend all their money on bonuses for their directors, the government gives them more of your money. and when the government and the mass media tell you it is all because of the homeless and sick and unemployed, you agree and vote for them again.

          • Susansayso

            In the U.S., the vote has become a worthless exercise. There is increasingly little difference between the two dominate political parties–they are both corrupt.

          • GSOB

            The election process is a front. It’s facade, with the MSM, are essential to any

          • Ralfine

            So, actually, who is most opposed to an ID-card for people to facilitate voter identification?

            America has 31 political parties.

            Why are only two parties dominating?

            Whom did you vote for last time?

            Do you think, voting is enough, or should there be more and other participation in the society?

          • Gay Veteran

            sorry susan, but no popular vote can deny people their rights

          • msbetz

            Glass-Steagall Law reinstated NOW will wipe out the fraudulent debt and jail big criminal bankers!

          • 1voluntaryist

            Yes, I agree. But this process is unsustainable because eventually the creators of the wealth being stollen are bankrupt and the system collapses. That’s what M.T. meant. Get it?

        • GSOB

          You Rodster have a skewed explanation of what socialism
          is. Read The Politically Incorrect Guide to Socialism

          And Rafline, do your share too, read the book,

          The Politically Incorrect Guide to Capitalism

          • 2Gary2

            I do not think rodster can read

        • 2Gary2

          the private sector pays too little. The state does not pay too much. Look at all the overpaid CEO.with golden parachutes.

      • Barn Cat

        It’s too bad you were indoctrinated by Marxists. You’re incredibly ignorant about real world economics. That’s necessary if you’re a liberal.

        • Ralfine

          And since you are experts in economics, America is the greatest. i c

          • MeMadMax

            You would make a great liberal, here’s some tampons….

          • Ralfine

            Keep them. You can use them to stop nose bleed.

            Or trade them in for some ammo water or chocolate.

          • Mondobeyondo

            Stock up on those, as you’ll need them to sell on the black market eventually.

          • Susansayso

            Ralfine is on the government dole and owes entire existence to hard working taxpayers. Who else could spend hours every day posting the same socialist communist claptrap?

      • Are you for real with such reasoning, or just high? Or maybe just being sarcastic? God I hope so, for if not, you’re going to get real hungry, real fast. Good luck out there.

        • Ralfine

          I’m for real.

          Why should I go hungry? I sell myself, my time, my body, my soul, to get some money, just like everybody else without capital.

          Then I can buy some food. Just enough to come back tomorrow.

          That’s how capitalism works.

          I get paid for the time I spend, not for the value I create. Because the owner of the capital (the capitalist) will sell the product for a price higher than my salary. And without doing anything by himself he will pocket the profit.

          Banks now own manufacturing companies. And those banks do not know anything about building cars, and therefore do not contribute the least bit in designing or producing a car. They only collect the profit.

          Capitalism, Imperialism (Empire-building by companies, conglomerates), Finance-capitalism, and if combines with aggressive nationalism: fascism.

          All depending on people selling the only thing they own: themselves. To make products, and create profit.

          It’s also a pyramid scheme, depending on growth and ever more people coming in. Best would be fully trained immigrants, and rich consumers.

          But some day, when all workers are fired and all consumers have spend all their money, the system will crash, unless you get into debts to buy new products, or as a manufacturer you introduce consumer credits – buy now, pay later.

          But will this ever work with farmers? Eat now, sow later?

          That’s the next step – feed workers with credits on future harvests.

          Works fine on paper, already. Trust me, the financial experts have already worked this out.

          • 2Gary2

            Ralfine–Most of the right wing nuts here are incapable of original thought, mush less any thought. All you need to do is read my original post about the south and you will understand why you keep getting these replies. I am using south for a metaphor for conservatives in the earlier post. As the replies you got show functional illiteracy is alive and well.

      • Mondobeyondo

        But in a socialist economy, someone has to pay for those goods and services. Someone has to pay to feed those people, to keep the lights on and the water flowing, etc.

        In a commie society, everyone (citizens) contributes to the common good, and no one owns anything of their own, as far as homes, land, private property, etc. The government owns it all. How does it pay for all that stuff? Through taxes? Not so much. It’s through “other people’s money”. In the case of Cuba, it was the Soviet Union. For North Korea, it’s China.

        The main reason why Cuba and N. Korea have made it this far for this long, has been help from their “friends”.

        • Ralfine

          No, in Communism, everybody owns everything. And since they really own the land and the production facilities, they put in their effort to multiply their possessions. And there is no government, no state, no border.

          It is in capitalism that the majority owns nothing but themselves.
          And the only thing they can sell is their time, knowledge, body, soul to get food, clothing, shelter.
          And as they do not own anything, they do not care about other people’s properties, or even common goods like air, water, nature.

          “I have barely money to feed myself and my family. You have enough money to buy a car, so you pay for clean air and clean water, education and safe streets.”

          In capitalism it’s always asymmetric warfare. I pick up a stone from the street and throw it through your window, forcing you to invest in a fence.

          Don’t like it? Feed me.
          Or give me the authority to work.
          I can find work, if you let me. I could build you a new fence, for example. 🙂

      • Susansayso

        Here’s a quote from the novel titled Animal Farm: “All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.” What happens with socialism and communism is that the corrupt leaders at the top and their cronies control all the wealth while the masses struggle to survive. The corrupt totalitarian leaders see themselves as more equal than others and they dictate to the masses what’s best for them. It’s happened in almost every country around the world and now it’s happening in the U.S. While the middle class in the U.S. continues to struggle and dwindle in size, the leader in the White House takes a $100 million trip to Africa and then takes a lavish vacation to Martha’s Vineyard–all on the taxpayer’s dime.

      • Chloe

        You don’t know the difference between Capitlaism and Socialism.

        • Ralfine

          Well, 40% of Americans are functionally illiterate. Where does this put you?

          I grew up in the Eastern Bloc of Europe. And no, that wasn’t communism.
          Communism doesn’t have states. It was thought, that socialism in one state could be the first step towards communism.

          As we know, it doesn’t work. We have to follow Marx’ way:

          Develop capitalism, until all people all over the world are so fed up with all the crisis, that they chuck away all their governments and parasite shareholders and start to own their own life and not only be held responsible but also have authority over themselves.

      • Captain Outrageous

        Refine its not the shareholders who steal the $$$ it’s the government who steals it from the corporations in the form of high taxes. The USA has highest corp tax rate in the world! Even that won’t be enuf to save the government from total collapse! It’s just a power struggle between those who believe you are too stupid to handle your money and those who believe you are responsible with your own $$$$.

        • Ralfine

          Corporate tax is a percentage of profit.

          And many companies do not even pay a single cent.

          And many others pay nothing but get a refund on unpaid taxes.
          Michael gave some examples in the past, check his archives.

      • @Ralfine=Troll.

    • rltmlt

      It must be tough these days to push that same old conservative dribble about Socialism since all of it’s institutions in this country were obliterated over sixty years ago by an authoritarian Right Wing who attempted to replace it with legislation that required mandatory Capitalist Loyalty Oaths by all citizens. It seems that this new generation have gained a new respect for the concept of Socialism and that doesn’t come as a surprise to most people after American Capitalist made sure that this and any future generations with an advanced education will never see a standard of living anywhere close to what their forebearers enjoyed !

  • K

    As a retiree, I do not expect the Government to keep its’ promises. But to tell someone you are going to cut them by 90%. They might as well just shoot you on the spot. Nobody I know could live on 50% of what they are getting, much less 10%. I hope everyone is making note of the hate you are seeing in some of the posts. The words they use today, while all is peaceful. Is the actions they will try to take, when things go down the drain. Prepare accordingly.

    • Obsolete

      Why didn’t the baby boomers invest their savings in something how come most of the baby boomers all are whining about having no money if social insecurity is cut? Were you baby boomers actually saving money for 30 years?

      And you have these public sector baby boomers crying out for 100k a year pensions, what the h3ll?! Why should taxpayers who barely make 20,000 a year foot the bill of handsome pensions.

      Pensions are supposed to be a supplement to retirement, not some luxury to spend vacation cruises. How could someone work for 40 years and save NOTHING especially when the only financial crises after 1945 were 2001-2002 and 2008—now?

      • K

        Yes, we have a little mob mentality going here. Many of us did put some money aside. 100k pensions, are only made by the ex-politicians and their appointees. Not by the people who went to work every day and did the job. Most of the people I know, take home less than a quarter of the amount you mention. The people I know who have the least. Spent it on raising their children, and sending them through college. I guess by your standards a silly expense. Now I know they do not teach history anymore, no financial crises between 1945 and 2001 yeah not even close to correct.

        • Rick

          Not sure we have a mob here or a kindergraten, K. I love how these children helped elect Obama, who is summarily destroying the economy and yet feel the need to blame their parents/grandparents for the situation we face.

          • K

            No Rick not kindergarden. These are the same kind of punks that put on the black uniform, with the cute SS on the collar. They ask what any of us have done to stop it? At 16 I was trying to stop the Vietnam war. I was tear gassed and beaten with a baton. Wonder if any of them have ever gotten out from behind their computer.

          • Ralfine

            Your crash didnt start with obama. didnt clinton produce a surplus, reducing debt? and who then started to get rid of him to spend a trillion a year on new wars?

            yeah, the socialist america.


          • Susansayso

            The current socialist regime in Washington DC has tripled the debt by trillions of dollars since taking office almost 5 years ago and has involved the U.S. in yet more armed conflicts such as Afghanistan. A record number of the people in the U.S. are on food stamps while a the labor participation rate is the lowest since 1979. One in six people in the U.S. are now dependent on government poverty programs! Meanwhile the commander in chief lives like a king while taking a lavish vacation on Martha’s Vineyard.

          • Ralfine

            So let me get this right, George W. Bush, who had Afghanistan attacked was the head of world Socialism, and is really the son of Leonid Breshnev?

          • Steven

            Um, Ralfine – no.

            Clinton did leave office with a surplus. That is true – once forced on him by the Gingrinch Congress and which he fought against and then took credit for. Learn history.

            And the deficit was not even CLOSE to 1 Trillion until Obama took office. During a WAR it was 300-500 Billion a year. Not good – and I’m not a fan of the Bush economic plan – just to be clear.

            Under Obama the deficit STARTED at 1.3 Trillion, and is now 1.1 Trillion – a claim where he touts his cutting the deficit since he has gotten into office (WTF!?).

            I’m not a (R) or a (D) – you need to get your facts right.

          • Ralfine


  • markthetruth

    Just like where back in 5th Grade.

    Time for the bully’s to steal our Lunch Money !!!

    the end…

  • tfb

    What’s all this “we” talk white man? I didn’t promise anybody isht.

    Just bustin your balls Mike. Very glad you talk on these issues so often!

  • bobcat

    Even if you have been saving aggressively for retirement, a couple months like May and June can wipe out a year’s worth of gains. Or the 3rd quarter of 2011. There’s nowhere to hide. Bank accounts don’t pay squat. Stocks and mutual funds are way too volatile and now interest rate fluctuations make tax free bonds lose value. Metals are being driven down with naked shorts. So those who have been investing are getting clobbered.

    • Jennifer

      All this is absolutely true. It’s very hard right now to know what to do to dodge the bullets coming in.

  • Obsolete

    Most of these baby boomers worked for over 30 years why couldn’t they save up their money in the 1980s when savings interest rates were over 10% or invest in their savings other than 401k frauds?

    Why should I feel sorry for entitled baby boomers who can’t understand that since more of them are fighting for 100k a year pensions in the public sector, we younger generations have to foot the bill or lose our jobs.

    We milennials didn’t cause no economic collapse or invading other people’s countries for oil… why should we pay for other people’s mistakes.

    • Walters

      Obsolete (funny knwing that you are a young person calling yourself Obsolete lol), I’m 27, worked full time for 6 years and with these food price inflation and housing bubble, I managed to save at least 6 months earnings…I assume you are refferring to those boomers who are working high scale jobs and not those boomers who are immigrants or low paid workers all their life…

      • Ralfine

        Saving just 6 months earnings in 6 years is not an achievement.

        But it shows the problem: wages and salaries are too low.

        Could you even afford to buy the products you make?

  • Richard

    “All of this could have been avoided if we would have planned ahead as a society.”
    This is horrendous English. You mean, “All of this could have been avoided if we HAD planned ahead as a society.
    You’d do yourself a favor, Michael, instead of spending your time deleting my posts about your English proficiency, get to grips with some of this loose and sloppy syntax and acknowledge gratitude for someone who admires your work enough to take the time to draw attention to these things…

    • someone give Richard a cookie please?

      • Walters

        Beth you look great! You’re cheerful in your picture. Youthful.

        • I am youthful—only almost 50! And thanks:)

  • Bad_Mr_Frosty

    Boomers don’t deserve to retire. They completely screwed up this country. Look at the nation they inherited, now look at the nation they are passing on to their children and grandchildren. Can they really even pretend this is “progress”? There’s an old Christian saying, “you reap what you sow”.

    • Rick

      You talking about the country we inherited that sent 58,000 of us to our deaths in Viet Nam? Kennedy was a boomer? Johnson was a boomer? Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan? All boomers?

      We boomers didn’t get to pick our birthdays. We didn’t get to vote for SS or Medicare. But we are the first generation to be FORCED into paying into both our entire working lives.
      If the system crashes, so be it. Just stop your incessant whining child. If your generation is as great as you all proclaim you’ll fix it all in 10 years.


    Apres moi, le Deluge

    • El Pollo de Oro

      Oui, d’accord. Après moi, le dèluge. Et comment j’aime dire en anglais….. God help La République Bananière d’Amérique.

      • Nixon1950

        ca va en france? Vous aves meme problem comme citoyens de monde. System ne pas just. Liberte, egalite, fraternite ce histoire

  • Ralfine

    You need to cut health care to everyone. People who die before pension age won’t need pension.

    And give them more guns.

    • americalsgt

      You really are two thirds of the three skipping down the yellow brick road with Dorothy.

    • Susansayso

      Socialists always ration healthcare and have death squads who delay treatment for the elderly in hopes that they will die before they receive treatment.

      • Ralfine

        You should get off those drugs.

        Really. Drink more water, it helps.

      • Ralfine

        If I would publish your posts in Europe, they’d all die of laughing.

        I really appreciate that you live at the end of the world.

      • Ralfine

        Healthcare in socialist country was rationed because socialist countries were prohibited to buy modern healthcare equipment on the so-called “free” market.

        Otherwise there wasn’t anything rationed. When I was 16 or 17 I went to hospital to have my broken nose fixed and didn’t even have to pay a cent. I stayed inside for a week, and when I returned to my apprenticeship, I still had the job.

        Everybody paid 10% of their salary into social security, which was for health care and pension.

        I paid 12% income tax.

        My parents paid less than 5% of their income for rent.

        When Socialism failed and everybody embraced capitalism, pension payments were delayed because of “computer error” for months. Rents increased 10-fold, factories with patents were bought by the competition and then shut down. Unemployment reached 75% in some cities and regions.

        People moved away, especially those with university degrees, and now live all over the world. They start to move back home with better economy. And having saved a substantial amount of money with their trained frugal “socialist”/prepper life style, they are now able to buy the cheap properties in the abandoned areas.

      • Gay Veteran

        and insurance companies don’t ration healthcare?

  • JulRan

    There’s been talk off and on about raising the retirement age in order to save MC and SS. It seems like a pretty easy issue to vote on, from my perspective. However, I had something of an epiphany while reading Michael’s article, then it gained support after reading some of the comments here.

    What the government will end up doing is LOWERING the retirement age and making it mandatory. This will free up jobs for the young-uns. The costs of living longer on SS and MC will be moot as we careen into National Healthcare because longevity statistics will drop precipitously. And if they don’t drop? Well, some version of the ice floe will be implemented by the gov’t.

  • John

    If the US government paid back to social security what they “borrowed” and stopped sending billions of dollars to other countries, we would have sufficient funds to support social security. They should also stop paying social security benefits to refugees that never worked in the US. I do not believe anyone should receive social security benefits that has not worked and paid into it. I paid into social security for 46 years mostly paying the maximum.
    If we had a president and congress that was truly for the country and not themselves and their leftist agenda, this country would have sufficient jobs, instead they bail out GM and then allow them to open plants in other countries, We bailed out foreign banks and now watch, they will bail out Detroit. The idea that a Detroit cop retires with benefits of $100,000.00 per year is ridiculous.

    • Jennifer

      Yes, to all you said.

    • Gay Veteran

      OR we could stop funding our empire by cutting the Pentagon budget by 50%.
      WHY are we sending money to back al Qaeda terrorists in Syria???

  • Moe

    It’s BS saying that the cities made these promises. The cities were strong armed by the worker unions ,( no union no crazy pensions) they deserve 10 cent on the dollar , this is what happens when you are greedy .

  • jerry

    YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY ON THE MONEY! Add to that the people that go on unemployment rather than working for less money. Jobs are out there, just because you were making $35.00 per hour as a carpenter and got laid off, then come and tell me you won’t work for less than $25.00 per hou….BS

    • Ralfine

      Not working is the best legal way to stop paying tax to your socialist government.

      • GSOB

        You have entered the twilight zone.

        • Robert (qslv)

          The Monsters have Arrived on Maple Street.

      • Susansayso

        That’s unless you are on the government dole collecting benefits paid for by hardworking taxpayers who are merely trying to survive and who are too tired from working to fight the corrupt socialist thugs who are taxing them to death.

        • Ralfine

          Well, if on the dole is such a good life, and you only work to feed your socialist president, why don’t you stop working and get on the dole yourself???

          You are not consistent!

          Are you afraid to be on the dole? Why? They get everything paid for, don’t they?

  • americalsgt

    Today, July 23rd, is my birthday and I am 66 years old and have reached full retirement age. I’ve signed up and will receive a check from the government who has held back money for me for 50 years. Over the course of those 50 years, I’m going to guess that they have put away roughly a quarter mil. Fifteen of those years I paid in as an employer and employee, so I paid double those years. The money they saved for me has gathered interest to the tune of .0.000000.0000 %. It’s not as if I had a choice in the matter I had to pay into this program which some of you say I should have recognized as a ponzi scheme. Save your lesson about how I could have opted out. If you accept wages you have to pay in. It’s simple as that. Try being an employer and decide not to pay you 941’s. See you in the slammer time.

    Although my wife and I have saved enough to live on for another 6 or 7 years, unfortunately, you really don’t know when you will be punching your final time card and so I will continue to work. Hope none of you are upset about the 20 odd hours I might pick up at Whole Food now that I have been put out to pasture by my employer. Besides needing the money. there’s something about the line six days shall you labor etc. My belief is that man should work. What bothers me is reading here about how evil I am for taking my money back. Riding Harley’s and for not saving enough not to need this income. First I don’t ride a Harley, and second, all I want is my money back. The money I might add gathered over the years, and I repeat,0.00000.0000 % interest. Some here even suggested that I should no longer get medical care and the government should give me a gun. My guess would be so that I would kill. So to those of you bemoaning my taking social security, rest assure, I don’t want your money. I just want my money back.

    Oh, and I’m not going to say The End. They person that does that at the end of each post is really annoying and as you know, old people get annoyed for no reason.

    • callmecordelia1

      I, too, am puzzled by the “you could have opted out” and other such ridiculous comments. I’ve been working since I was 14 years old, and I’m now an employer. If I “opt out”, I go to jail. I’m sitting here slack-jawed at the disrespect to the baby boomer generation. It must be a “millennial” thing. I’m not sure what I am– my parents are boomers, my children might be considered millennials, so I’m somewhere in between. But I do know that every job I ever had was there because of a baby boomer. At the very least, they deserve the money they were forced to put into the system, and I understand that they’re angry. As for me, I wrote off social security a long time ago. I think of it is “money lost” every month. If I ever get any of it back, it will just be a happy surprise.

      • americalsgt

        Thank you for your reply. Today a former employee of mine dropped off a bottle of 10 year old Scotch wishing me a Happy Birthday and thanked me for being the best boss she ever had.

        • callmecordelia1

          Happy birthday to you!! That was a sweet gesture from your former employee. I hope to be remembered as fondly by my employees someday. I hope you can enjoy your day and reflect with a happy heart on all you have contributed to society.

          • americalsgt

            Tears to eyes. Good night.

    • GSOB

      I’m 51 and tell my kitty to shut up.

  • socialism sucks

    the government stole over money from every paycheck for 40 years so that I wouldn’t have to save. Now I want my money. I never voted them in. I HATE SOCIAL SECURITY. But it is my money. I want them to give it to me, not to you

  • condaggitt

    OH BOO HOO HOO….When you work for a company that’s 24/7 someone has to be there at all times…I learned this when i was 20 years old…and got my first job at a TV station in Waterbury CT..getting up at 4:30 am to start work at 5;30 am….it was one heck of a challenge since I was a night person.

    —-or work nights or weekends.

  • Jennifer

    If people understood the proper role of government and how it is to be LIMITED, none of these problems would exist.

    The gov should not be in the business of providing retirement income, health care, welfare, food stamps, etc. etc. Politicians found a way to buy votes, but now the chickens are coming home to roost. America is now a debtor nation, and very soon we will look like Greece.

    • Reynaldo Neggle

      POTD. As warm and fuzzy as it sounds that we should all chip in for the common good, it is a fact that no govt like ours could ever manage such a program without it devolving into what we see happening today. Before the govt and corporations destroyed our communities, our communities took care of each other. Today, we don’t really have communities. Today, people do not even know the names of their neighbors, and they really do not care.

    • robert burns

      We will be lucky to do as well as Greece. Unlike the Europeans, we have citizens armed to the teeth and angry. We are balkanized with all the races and ethnic groups. I’d say we are more like the former Yugoslavia when it broke up and the Serbs and Croats (Christians and Moslems) slaughtered each other.

  • LC

    Social Security is just another Ponzi scheme that the stupid people voted for–trusting politicians to create a “trust fund” to keep your money safely for you? Haha! Are you that dumb? When has a government EVER kept its promises to people? NEVER. With the Federal Reserve devaluing the dollar every second of the day for the past 100 years, NO ONE can save anything. The system was designed to extract the most wealth and energy it could before collapsing and allowing the international banking cartel to consolidate the world into one global currency and government. And our stupid grandparents fell for it hook, line, and sinker. We’re STILL falling for it today! Now, let’s get back to watching the birth of the royal parasite. One more mouth for us peasants to feed!

  • RarefiedSnotress

    On the bright side, with the passing of the elders, the prices of a lot of everyday object and houses will likely deflate, and the people who were never promised very much anyways may gain some equality with elitists.
    And since we’re so fond of painting bleak scenarios on this site, if H7N9 does turn into a pandemic, which is no flimsy notion, the senior group will die out at a much more rapid rate creating less strain on the Social Security system.

  • Erik

    Looks like we’re going to have to print more Schrute bucks to stay afloat.

  • SafetyViking

    Are there any ‘safeguards’ in place to ensure that the more affluent retirees don’t qualify for ss payments? Seems a waste of money to give a millionaire pocket change every month…

    • Susansayso

      How much money qualifies one as affluent?

      • SafetyViking

        Good question…

        Let’s say a retirement income of $200k/year. Not a number of affluence, per se, but that’ll get ya by…

  • cracker

    Social Security was hijacked back in the 1980s by President Reagan and Greenspan. Social Security taxes were increased twice and shortly thereafter funds were being raided on a regular basis to help fund various programs and projects. At one time there was over 2 trillion dollars now most of the funds are gone and all that is left now is a pile of IOUs. Now there is talk of raising the taxes again.

    Good Luck and Good Night.

    • Susansayso

      Wrong. Both political parties raided the Social Security Trust Fund. The IOUs are worthless.

      • cracker

        It all started under Reagan’s presidency. Yes the democrats are just as guilty. Furthermore, read the book “Greenspan’s Fraud” by Ravi Batra, it provides all the details. Their goal was to use the funds now for worthless pork barrel projects. They didn’t care about the retirees. Read the book…

  • alan9074

    How the heck am I supposed to “save” for retirement when the best paying job I can get is less than $20/hr, and rent for any place outside of the ghetto is $1,000/month and gas is $4/gal and it takes $30 to fill a single plastic bag of groceries with quality food?

  • micky

    OK we all see the problem…so lets come up with solutions instead of pointing fingers and playing the blame game. The boomers are old and many are unable to work. I personally do not want to see them starving and dumpster diving in their old age. I also see that the promises cannot be kept to pay them what we said we would (as a society) about we make social security needs based? Use up your savings before you ask somebody else to pay for your needs. Iets face it, Warren Buffet REALLY does not NEED his social security check, he will never be hungry.. Lots of retirees have a home…reverse mortgage it…you live in it till you die and when you are gone you cannot take it with you anyway. Use your 401K up first, before you recieve public money. Now as for some of you spewing hate at all the “rich” public workers…back off a bit…I am a teacher, I have worked 20 years and plan to work 20 more, I have a car with over 200K miles on it, buy my clothes at goodwill and cannot even remember the last time I had a steak..I am not getting rich off the taxpayers..I teach because I wanted to pay it forward and serve my community as well as help teach kids so they could have a future. My pension, if I ever see a dime of it, will be pathetic, and as a public employee I cannot recieve social security. Worse, my wife ALSO cannot recieve her social security because of the law, since she married a teacher…even though she paid her way in…So at best there will be two people trying to live on one pension. Lots of you guys have a woodie about those giant $100K pensions, but trust me…99.99% of us public employees are NOT even close to getting that. And we are mad about the bigshots stealing that money directly out of our mouths. So I guess even in public service there are the 1% and the 99% who are poor. A buddy of mine just retired from law enforcement..after 20 years he got a check when he cashed out his pension $9000…or he could have taken $47 a month for life. So why do I teach? Because I am the only hope for a future for a lot of kids who were not born with a silver spoon. They need basic job and life skills and I am willing to help them. And guess what, I actually do have enough talent to do something else… masters degrees in math and physics have merit, and I paid for them. Even in this economy, I could double my wages in a week by going into the private sector…there are plenty of jobs out there for people with REAL degrees, so I ask the many angry young people who cannot get jobs or pay back their student loans…why did you specialize in beer drinking instead of learning something in college that is marketable? Too lazy or too stupid to take the hard classes I guess.
    Therefore, both young and old made bad choices, and both believed and bought into mass delusions and fairy tales…get a degree or that the government would take care of you…..and our economy is screwed up beyond repair…so now what do we do? I want to see some useful and practical suggestions from both sides. Me, I am stuck in the middle of this too old to be a melennial and too young to be a boomer…perfectly screwed from both sides.

    • Habib Jamaroqui

      Well, they are not completely worthless, they can always serve as a bad example to the youth that voted for 0bama. They should now recognize why socialism and liberalism always have failed, and why it is once again failing here.

  • Barn Cat

    That would concern me if I thought the economy would keep going for that long.

  • Arjun

    The boomers started work in America during the good times when there good jobs unlike those we find today. They should have prepared and if they are ill prepared for retirement-it means they have lived beyond their means. That is never a wise thing to do. Worse, is relying on the govt for help just because they told you they will help you in future…come on, when has the govt ever spoken the truth?

    • Mary

      Some boomers started their own business and created jobs. When the going got a little rough we put our retirement back into the business because we had that belief and faith in ourselves that times would get better. We felt a responsibility to the hard working employees that helped build our company. You must understand not everyone was out for a party living beyond their means. Try starting a business with all the rules and regulations and offering employment in the private sector. Not very intelligent to be so judgmental until you walked a mile in the other’s shoes.

  • Joe Dirt

    the problem is caused by having the money that was put in to the accounts and saved and invested, stolen by the people in charge of the accounts. The money was there, as it was PAID into the accounts by the retirees and the employers while they were working. This was never to be an “unfunded” obligation. It was funded and the politicians embezzled and misappropriated the funds and now do not want the spot light on themselves and be found out to be the thieves they are and prosecuted and imprisoned for such and all of their ill gotten wealth taken from them,,,

  • Naples Florida

    Learning the hard way. Half of the electorate is fiscally and morally irresponsible. The system will have to borrow money till it collapses. Half of the electorate has no clue that America is broke and borrows Billions everyday because it can’t pay its bills. They still think America is the richest nation on earth and not the most indebted nation on earth. Look at the Michigan judge ordering Detroit bankruptcy filing withdrawn; Said it’s ‘not honoring’ Obama, and its unconstitutional. First of all, the President is a government employee, NOT a Patriarch, Pope, Priest or King. Perhaps said Judge can order gravity unconstitutional next. “What do you mean I am broke, I still have checks.” type logic. Watch MSNBC (MSLSD) for any length of time and all they are talking about are social issues, affirmative action, gay marriage, global warming, diversity. News flash: The US will borrow and collapse and cease to be a nation as you know it way before global warming floods Florida, etc. (Yet it does not “sound good” to an optimistically broke debor.) The most important issues are jobs and fiscal sanity. But what we have is fiscal insanity. The government will borrow money till they collapse the system, till they can’t borrow any more money. Detroit is America’s financial future.

    I am Generation X raised by a Greatest Generation Grandmother, who went through the depression and assembled B17 Bombers during WWII. Baby Boomers grew up post WWII prosperity and their formative years are optimistic, and so is their outlook on life. That historic prosperity was purchased with the death of 50 million people during WWII. They never saw that bill. I saw a huge difference between the saving, and borrowing habits of the Greatest Generation and their kids the Baby Boomers. This generation is now running the government like they run their household, borrowing and spending, gambling in Wall Street Casino, abhorant to their parents. Baby Boomers are consumers, the largest in history. Fat Kitchen, lean Will. I don’t expect them to leave anything but a bill. Thank God I have dual citizenship because I have lived fiscally responsible and I am not paying for the profligate.

  • steve w

    I promised them nothing. Please don’t say WE promised them anything. What they promised themselves was someone else’s money, taken by force.

  • jakartaman

    I am thinking we should use our strengths to get us out of this mess. At the very least it will postpone the inevitable – What are we the best at in the world – Yup – WAR. I figure the Middle-East could use a real war – none of this special ops stuff – but a full blown biggy that allows us to take over all the oil producing areas.
    Just kidding – We have been at war- and the Government has won! Bring on the revolution

    • BasementDweller_at29yearsold

      Wow so millions of Arabs and Israelis in the Middle East should suffer in war just to get more money for the Baby Boomers? Wow..

      • jakartaman

        Did you miss the just kidding.
        I however would not be surprised if at some governmental level this has been reviewed.
        We have no one to blame but ourselves – We have allowed government to get so big and spend and waste so much. If I were 29 – I would be very upset at the previous generations for taking your future away – I would also join the Tea Party

      • GSOB

        go blow


    What’s happened is globalization. Detroit used to be a thriving city with lots of middle class jobs and from the vantage point of the 60’s- to early 80’s all looked good. Those jobs are long gone and will not return certainly for the foreseeable future. People in India, Korea, China, Brazil and many other places can do your job for less. So what you have is a declining job market but still have Americans with a lifestyle expectation that doesn’t match reality. Make no mistake, this is the future of America as compitition for jobs/production/manufacturing will only become more fierce. Ultimately, Capitalism and Socialism in concert have led us naturally to this juncture and as we’ll all see, we’ve run the course and now headed for a steady decline…

    • Susansayso

      Corrupt U.S. leaders in both political parties have sold out U.S. citizens by adopting one sided trade agreements that favored every country but the U.S.! Those insane trade agreements have decimated manufacturing in this country!


        Capitalism doesn’t owe anyone anything. It job is to find another consumer at a lower cost and higher margin…

    • WhatWillYouDoWithoutFreedom

      Capitalism didn’t do this crony capitalism did, and you would do well to learn the difference.


        Like capitalism hasn’t always been that way, is that what you’re saying, that it use to be fair? Find another job or get used to it…

  • Trailer Park Investor

    “Bitterly Dissapointed”
    I guess that means my Detroit City pension will now only pay me $200 instead of the $2000 I was getting. How do they expect anyone to live on $200 a month??? I guess I better find me a cardboard box and a place to park it down by the river. I also better start liking rat meat as well.
    It’s gonna get bad y’all, REAL BAD!
    Dig in it’s gonna be a really rough ride.

  • LeseMajeste

    Take all my SS money due to me and all of my pension, I don’t care, as
    long as that money keeps those ‘Too Big to Fail’ Wall Street banks in
    business so they can steal more and pay their CEO’s million dollar
    bonuses, that’s what really matters!

    Watch for an uptick in the elderly going into the banking business and I don’t mean by opening an account.

  • “V”

    How does one look an elderly person in the eye knowing what is and continues to be done by our Government? I observed a pair of Grandparents with what appeared to be their grandchildren at our local park. I can only imagine the anger they would display if they knew ALL the information that was presented in this article and previous ones on this site related to this issue. What is being done to the past and future generations is criminal. The Democrats think they can spend us out of recession and the Republicans with their token spending cuts and sequesters. It is hard to grasp the concept that no one in Government is willing to speak out loud and in defiance of what is happening. They see themsleves as the shepherd herding the sheeple, knowing full well what lies ahead. I enjoy writing my Senator and Congressman in response to this issue. It does no good except to let them know that there does exist a section of the population that knows full well what is going on, and I am telling everyone who will listen.

  • seth datta

    On another note…

    It is likely that Prince William and/or his newborn baby boy are closely allied to the Antichrist, if not being the entity themselves.

  • Sandbagger

    Hopefully most of those Boomers were good examples to their own
    children when it came time to decide “what to do with grandma” in her
    old age. Hopefully grandma came to live out her days in the home of
    their child surrounded by people who cared…bringing along whatever
    money she MAY have managed to save while raising her family.

    Junior will remember that.

    if they stuck her in a nursing home so they wouldn’t be “bothered” and
    could “live their lives”, they are in for a rude awakening when their
    own children realize that there’s no money for a nursing home FOR THEM.
    Then the question of, “what to do with Boomer grandma” gets a little
    more interesting, wouldn’t you say? Why should Junior even think of
    letting Boomer grandma live with them?

    Prediction: Just as one
    “dead-heads” a growing basket of flowers to give energy to those who
    are just emerging, so will the state “dead-head” Boomer grandma. Can
    you say death panel?

    Then again, Junior may not have a choice. He may already be moved in with Boomer grandma because he can’t find a job!

  • ArigatouGozaimas

    This one piece of the puzzle of why the Republic is failing, a mighty big piece. What can we expect though, the retirement system is monopolized by central planners and huge banks that might as well be an arm of the government. It is socialized retirement. Socialized businesses run under the model of central planning are prone to corruption and eventually fail under its weight.

    I can always appreciate the mainstream media though, they make me feel so much better. Yesterday I heard three times that business optimism poll is at an all time high, and twice that our own version of Dear Leader is going on a recovery tour. I feel so much better now.

    Fundamentals, what fundamentals? I have to search out web blog to find them. 🙂

  • robert burns

    Blame game is irrelevant. Our culture/society is experiencing a major paradigm shift and our response to it is inadequate to say the least. In hard times, families will need to pull together rather than split in 10 directions with granny living over there and elsewhere. We are going to need to pool resources which is another reason I made sure to pay off my house and NOT move into a 55+ retirement community. IF one of my children and their family needs to move in with us, we’ll make room. Too many families have disintegrated in this dysfunctional social construct. Where families might unite for a common cause—SURVIVAL— instead we still opt for the go-it-alone stuff. Won’t work. Individual preppers won’t last either. Eventually you run out of your stuff. No division of labor. No backup. For my part, the best thing people can do is reunite families for mutual support.

    • ArigatouGozaimas

      You are spot on. No matter what happens one will always have to deal with people. A strong family network is source of great strength in trying times. It is a shame the family unit has been so decayed in our culture.

      Retirement homes are designed to suck fiscal blood, then it’s the off to the county home when the money runs dry. I’ve been in municipal homes as a visitor. The thought of them makes me cringe. If you’re infirm without good family support or lots of money, there is no where else to go it seems.

  • Yes, it’s coming. Invest now in gold, silver, canned foods/water, and ammunition. HThese will be the currencies of the not too distant future. Place no faith in banks. Think I am jst being silly? Well, to each his own. Sleep well tonight, I do.

  • krinks

    Obama Care will take care of it when it completely bankrupts private insurance and then stops providing care to the elderly or worse they are forcibly killed off.

  • Mondobeyondo


    Breaking news: ABC, CBS, NBC, Fox and MSNBC are all reporting the young Prince has just pooped in his diapers for the first time! (but not for the last time, surely!!) William and Kate are reported to be, um, well pleased about the day’s events.

    I’m aready sick of hearing about this royal baby…crap!
    Okay, back on topic.

    The problem in my view – is that government promised people the moon, and it now doesn’t even have the money to deliver green cheese. It made these promises at a time when America was an economic powerhouse. Even back then, such a government obligation was unsustainable.

    When Social Instability was established in 1935, few people took into account rising life expectancy, a declining standard of living, or the post Baby Boom birth rate, among several factors. Now we have something like 3 workers supporting every retiree on Social Security, and it’s going to get worse.

    I’ve already accepted that by the time I reach retirement age, there will be nothing left. No Social Security, no pensions, no retirement, not one red cent. It’s not fair. I paid into the system, right? (“It’s your money! You paid for it!” – George W. Bush) Here’s where the words “Ponzi scheme” come into play. Those who retired in the 1940’s, 50’s and ’60’s made off reasonably well. They’re getting their $1,000, $1,500 a month. The rest of us… get sweet nothing. Zilch. Nada.

  • Mary Brown

    If these pension plans wouldn’t have been raided to feed city/state/federal budgets, and if the fed reserve hadn’t crashed interest rates most of these plans would be financially sound. The problem is politicians seeing this as easy money to fix their over spending habits.

  • robert burns

    Americans shot themselves in their respective feet when the culture said it was ok to carry debt to achieve the American dream. Madison Ave encouraged that mindset. Fun now, pay later. Later has a terrible habit of showing up. I am grateful to my father who taught me to fear debt more than any other situation in life. It enslaves. Now the nation is enslaved to its debt. If your wants exceed your ability to pay in cash, you are doomed. Unfortunately, the debt system will take everyone down. Except for the 1%.

    • Mondobeyondo

      Proverbs 22:7 never sounded so true as it is today. America was once masters of its own destiny. Now we are indebted. Thus, we have new masters, and trust me, their destiny is not the same as ours.

  • El Pollo de Oro

    Yes, the retirement crisis is going to be a huge nightmare in The Banana Republic of America, the Third World slop bucket that used to be Los Estados Unidos. Granny, a.k.a. Abuelita, is likely to be going hungry, and many aging, bitter Gen-Xers like myself are screwed as well. Many of us self-employed, small-business-running X-ers realized that we couldn’t count on social security alone; so we started individual retirement
    accounts (SEP IRAs). Probléma Número Uno: thanks to that abomination known as the Federal Reserve and their pathetically low interest rates, a lot of IRAs are much smaller than they should be. Probléma Número Dos: because the BRA is in a depression and many small businesses have become less profitable (if they’re still in business at all), the self-employed have less to contribute to their IRAs. Bernanke and his banksters cronies want to bully you into putting your life savings in the stock market, but the roulette wheel in Atlantic City would be a lot less risky.

    But hey: at least X-ers benefitted from the prosperity of the ’90s. Our younger amigos, the Millennials, a.k.a. Gen-Y, are seriously screwed because they entered adulthood when the BRA was in serious decline. Thanks to low wages, inadequate access to health care and preventative medicine and lower life expectancy, and GMO poision, many Millennials won’t have a chance to grow old.

    And there will be major problems overseas as well. I know some British pensioners and pensioners-to-be living in Andalucia, and I’ve been warning them that they will be in a seriously bad position if the banksters steal their retirement accounts. Any British pensioner living in Andalucia would do well to heed the warnings of Nigel Farage, head of the UK Independence Party.

    “Evenin my direst predictions about the way the EU bosses were behaving, never did I
    think that they would—in a completely unprecedented manner—resort to stealing
    money from people’s bank accounts. They will do anything to keep the euro afloat, and now, they have resorted to what can only be described as theft. Now that they have done it in one country, they are quite capable of doing it in Italy, Spain, Portugal or anywhere else. And the message that sends to people who’ve got savings in those countries is, ‘Get your money out while you can.’” —Nigel Farage, leader of the UK
    Independence Party

    “What the British government needs to do is to say to the hundreds of thousands of Brits that are living in Southern Spain—mostly pensioners—is, ‘For goodness sake, get your money out of that country, and have a monthly transfer to pay
    your bills.’” —Nigel Farage, leader of the UK Independence Party

    God help Europe, and God help the rotting, decaying, collapsing hellhole known as The Banana Republic of America.

    • Nixon1950

      michael, why cant I like some comments? Like this one…problemo numero dos LOL

  • Nixon1950

    Today, I was talking to some nice people from Switzerland. If It comfort you, Swiss are also in banana. Their economy is shaken by EU ban on banking secret. So their core business, shadow banking, is slowly but persistent being shut down and exported to other unregulated countries.

    PS: short Conclusion of our talk; USA is exploiting EU and euro crisis to cover on their own dollar crisis. And whats even worse, USA is using their investment banks to hurt eurozone so that dollar can remain world single reserve currency. What do you think about this thesis?

    • GSOB

      Our government sends our youth prepared to die to maintain petrodollar status.

      (in support of the thesis.)

  • Tommy

    US involvement in Syria could cost $1bn a month, warns top army chief! How about if we stay out of this one and give this money to the US Retirement fund!!! I don’t believe half what is reported these days, but I do KNOW the TRUTH is Found between the pages of the KJV BIBLE!

  • GSOB

    I thought everybody wanted a government job.

  • 2Gary2

    in the south, people believe that Fox news is fair and balanced,
    resslin(wrestling) is real and Jesus Christ is coming on Tuesday. They
    read nothing, question nothing and believe what the talking head on TV
    and their pastor tells them is the truth because it’s what they want to
    believe. We live in states that are considered as backward because we
    have republician governors we voted in. A lot would have to change for
    us to become upwardly mobile I believe. I don’t think it will happen in
    my lifetime.

    • rat28

      it is hard to fix stupid..

    • Susansayso

      Nothing dumber than an ignorant black slave on the Democrat entitlement plantation.

  • 2Gary2

    The right to work for less states have the lowest upward mobility. The conservative South is the worst in the nation for upward mobility.

    These low info conservative voters keep voting to “keep ‘Merica strong!”

    • Susansayso

      Wrong again. The Northeast and the “rust bucket” upper mid-west has been losing jobs for decades because of union thugs that have bankrupted companies and now have even bankrupted once great cities like Detroit. 2Gary2 is one of the low info leftist voters who believe all the Marxist garbage coming from the Democrat Party hacks. There is no upward mobility for the poor in Detroit who are completely dependent on welfare handed out by their corrupt black slave masters in Detroit city government.

  • GSOB

    tsa is government
    could have been contracted out

  • Mudpie

    They are going to raise your taxes of course.

    –I would reply, over me dead body. And no doubt, by the time they finish with me I would end up a carcass. But at least still a man.

    • 1voluntaryist

      I started working at 12 for 50 cents/hr. in 1954. I got my first paycheck and was furious I was robbed (taxes). I quit and started mowing lawns to avoid (protest) taxation. I boycotted govt. my whole life and am retired, living comfortably. I have never supported govt. in any way, financially or spiritually. I see war as a govt. scam.

  • WhatWillYouDoWithoutFreedom

    While I sympathize with their situation, they did it to themselves. They where so wrapped up in enjoying the benefits of this great country that they let elected thieves rob the SS, they allowed the gov to over spend, take their freedoms, and now they will vote for anyone that promises not to take away their drug benefits or any other benefits for that matter. Dam the grand children and great grand children. Thanks to them this once great country is no more. It has been robbed and pilaged by their generation.

  • 1voluntaryist

    Did anyone learn the lesson here? What is the solution to the economic collapse? How can we stop it and keep it from ever happening again? How can we rebuild our nation, e.g., our infrastructure?

    Simple: Give up slavery. Give up your faith in govt. Stop supporting your masters, e.g., stop paying taxes. Taxes are the lifeblood of “Our Enemy: The State.” Admit you created this monster, stop it, and move on with your life.

  • Gay Veteran

    and just how many unwanted babies did YOU adopt?

  • cschuz

    Interesting that AARP is part of the reason for there being so many poor elderly and ObamaCare will make it so much worse.

  • concerndcitizen

    It used to be that cops had great pensions, because they risked their lives every day. However, the desk jockeys saw something they, too, desired and with the right political arm twisting, they succeeded in bankrupting the whole thing.

    • MLog70

      Horsecrap. Cops’ jobs aren’t even in the top ten most dangerous and none of those other people get pensions. We need to eliminate pensions for all public sector workers except the military.

  • BlackVoid

    The biggest oil discovery of the last 50 years will surely solve this crisis. 😉

  • BlackVoid

    How can get it worse, when we just found a lot of cheap oil?

    Soon, oil prices will plummet and the economy will soar.


  • msbetz

    Better DEMAND reinstatement of the Glass-Steagall Law immediately to wipe out the fraudulent debt created by bankers for bankers! It’s NOT our debt!

  • MeanGranny

    “In 1945, there were 42 workers for every retiree receiving Social Security benefits. Today, that number has fallen to 2.5 workers,
    and if you eliminate all government workers, that leaves only 1.6
    private sector workers for every retiree receiving Social Security
    benefits.” A direct result of over 40 years of abortion. You can’t keep killing off the next generation and expect to prosper.

    • 1voluntaryist

      That’s not it. You can’t keep supporting govt. and expect to prosper. It is anti-life, pro theft.

    • Ralfine

      Don’t just take workers/retiree.
      Use workers/non-workers

      Non-workers being retirees, children, soldiers, invalids, politicians, other government workers.

      BTW, the USA has a population growth rate only comparable with a third world country.

  • ThomasCollins1

    “In 1945, there were 42 workers for every retiree receiving Social Security benefits. Today, that number has fallen to 2.5 workers…”

    …which means that if you receive $1500/mo in SS, those workers have to chip in $600/mo EACH just for you!

  • Jon Fisher

    I don’t care what you call what the US has, it isn’t what I agreed to. Oh wait, I never agreed to anything. Funny how that works.

    • Ralfine

      You don’t agree? Fine.


  • sunbeltstatesuccess

    basic econ 101 and 102 (micro and macro economics teaches you most you need to know about why a free market works and why government does not. First and foremost government does not create money/wealth. It is a parasite. Government is best in a limited capacity (and very inefficient at best in any capacity). In simple terms, a $1 in the private sector produces almost 10X more GDP than government. In fact a $1 of tax money given to the government creates about $0.70 in GDP. If you cant make sense of that then go back to the first sentence and read that until you do understand it.

  • Susansayso

    I’m so sorry to ALL ! A coward has used my name to print IGNORANT Hateful & uneducated opinions that this person is obviously ashamed to put their own name on. I do NOT agree with ANY statement previously posted on this or any other site that spreads hate & ignorance, & I wish to apologize that any one may have thought that I would rite or think any such ridiculous ideas.

  • rob mac

    with everyone blaming everyone else, who do I blame!!! we are living in a broken system. it has been broken since the start. we have been decline since the word go! I’m voting for Hilary Clinton next election. if anyone can fix us, she can!

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